7 ms·

How to make $250 a day (and get banned from the Android Market)

122 points by obviator 15y ago

fromany 15y ago
I read your article and couldn't find an answer to "How to make $250 a day"
rhygar 15y ago
By attracting developers like this guy, Google is going to have a very hard time competing with Apple. The Android Market is filled with apps like this. More so than the iOS App Store by far.
- 0x12 15y ago
  What do you think is wrong with it? 'Apps like this' apparently didn't exist, according to the article he searched for one. As far as I can see he simply filled a need. If google would be so kind as to state what their problem is with it, who knows, it might see a revival.
  - rhygar 15y ago
    Android is "open" - so just about anything goes. It uses Java, that starter language for just about anyone who learns how to program these days. So you end up with an environment that is very conducive to spamware/adware type apps and people trying to get rich quick. It only takes a few bad apps before it becomes like Windows, where users are afraid to install anything new or off-brand.
    - jamesbritt 15y ago
      before it becomes like Windows, where users are afraid to install anything new or off-brand. Is that even true? I keep hearing how Windows users are not selective enough about what they install.
      - alanh 15y ago
        Sure, but it’s true for some people. Wasn’t there a story about someone’s mom who was afraid to install programs on the PC but enjoys installing apps to her new iPad? Now substitute a Galaxy Tab for the iPad and have her read a story about Android app malware in her Reader’s Digest.
        rblackwater 15y ago
        Fantastic results like these are why scientific studies all use "someone's mom" as a sample size.
    - 0x12 15y ago
      That doesn't address at all what is specifically wrong with this particular app, other than possibly the logo.
    - there 15y ago
      right, because nobody ever made fart apps and other tacky shit in objective c.
      - jamesbritt 15y ago
        Plus a common complaint about android is the app dev environment and tools suck compared to iOS. People interested in creating crap seem to find a way, platform notwithstanding.
        woodall 15y ago
        Because I do not have a Mac(and cannot run OSX in a VM) I am kind of left out in the cold when it comes to developing apps for the iOS. Granted, the Android SDK can, at times, be a bit wonky(sometimes taking as long as 10 mins to boot into a VM) it is still there and available to all platforms. To say it sucks is a pretty tall order.
        obviator 15y ago
        I agree. The barrier to entry for developing iOS apps is too high for me, as I'd have to buy a Mac and, realistically speaking, an iOS device for testing. But I can run the Android SDK on all my computers, Windows & Linux alike, so development is available wherever I am. Also, the Android SDK works really well for testing with a physical device. Plug in by USB, or use wireless ADB, and it only takes a couple of seconds to deploy a debug package to your testing device. Much faster than using the emulator.
        jamesbritt 15y ago
        "To say it sucks is a pretty tall order." I agree, but look through past posts on hn and see if this isn't a oft-mentined opinion.
    - jonknee 15y ago
      > that starter language for just about anyone who learns how to program these days It's also the language that most big businesses run on these days. It's popular to learn because it's used many places (e.g. useful). Language has nothing to do with it. The iTunes App Store is riddled with comically bad apps and that's never going to change. NetFlix is also riddled with horrible movies, it's the nature of the business.
    - kokey 15y ago
      I actually had a dream last night that I was sent a video that I viewed on my Mac, and only after running it realized it was a trojan. In my dream I felt stupid and also amused at the fact that there are Mac trojans. Then I woke up from my dream, and remembered the trojan wouldn't have been able to run without asking me first and wouldn't have been able to install anything with asking me to type in my password.
- deleted 15y ago
  [deleted]
Mizza 15y ago
This is a really scammy website - I really don't like it. The goal shouldn't be to make money with Android - it should be to make interesting and high quality software products for your customers. I should also mention that I make more than $1000 a month, the site's goal, by selling Android apps.
- jpulgarin 15y ago
  Why shouldn't the goal be to make money with Android?
  - Mizza 15y ago
    Because if that's your only goal, you end up producing low-quality, mass-produced garbage - "shovelware" - and that's no way to go through life, in my opinion.
    - daleharvey 15y ago
      1. Its pretty presumptious to be telling people what their life goals are 2. Making quality products is not mutually exclusive from building quality products, I hate to bring them up as an example but not many people could argue that apple produces mass produced garbage, and they do fairly well on the money side.
    - jamesbritt 15y ago
      Does "low-quality, mass-produced garbage" make a developer more money than quality apps? I'm skeptical, but I don't have figures. Still, a race to the bottom and near-zero margins, because crap is easy to replicate, seems like a bad plan for real profits.
      - Mizza 15y ago
        In the long run, no, I don't think low quality apps make more money than by high quality ones. But that's not to say that there isn't any money to be made by selling garbage. I'm not saying that it's bad to make money - quite the opposite! All I'm saying is that shitty software sucks. Writing it sucks, selling it sucks, buying it sucks and using it sucks. Build cool stuff instead.
nohat 15y ago
Another possible motivation for google suspending the app was that it abused the google plus invitation system. That probably isn't explicitly against the rules of the android market place, but it probably is against the rules or at least intention of google plus, and there has to be some protective bleed over from other google properties.
ig1 15y ago
Here's a simple rule: Don't use someone-else's trademark as the fist word of your product name. The first word is typically used to imply endorsement or officialness. So for example Microsoft X or Google Y. If you build a product based on a third party service, you can generally use the trademark in your name for example "Bob's invites to Google+", as long as it's clear it's not an officially produced or endorsed product.
- robryan 15y ago
  With Google though you would ideally want to avoid it altogether, although in this case that wouldn't really be possible. A lot of Google logos have specific terms of use, most of which include that they can't be modified in any way which I thinking might have resulted in the ban in this case.
benregenspan 15y ago
"Big corporations don’t understand, even if you’re 'trying to do the right thing'." Really? This guy was making money by offering a dubious service leveraging someone else's brand. As he admits, it was an experiment and the way he conducted it was very ill-advised. Own up to it, don't whine about not being "understood".
DanielBMarkham 15y ago
Damn. Talk about targeted content. The guy writes an article on a failed Android experiment, makes the front page of HN. I click on the link and I'm on a blog with 32 articles in the last couple of months, all highly-targeted at Android developers. Android book ads on the side. All very nicely put-together (I know some folks would consider my analysis an attack. It is not.) This guy is either going to make money on Android apps or make money advertising about them! I like the app idea, but the story shows something really sad about these app marketplaces -- there's so much social engineering it's not funny. The right name, the right logo, the right first customers, the right momentum -- if the die come up the right way, you're on a roll. But if something happens to mess up one or two aspects of it? It can all fall apart. Or to put another way people buying the app are the number one signal for other people to buy the app. So it's kind of a weird little high-stakes popularity contest, at least as far as I can tell. I just think it's cool that the author took the failed app idea, turned it around into a blog entry, and then might make a few bucks on that. Having the targeted blog to go along with your app efforts was very smart. If nothing else, as long as you keep trying, even if you go through a hundred ideas which never pan out, you could end up with a nice ebook out of all of it one day. Call it something like "How to win by failing"
- ansy 15y ago
  Regarding your social engineering comment, I think this is a side effect of digital content distribution in general. With all the scaling handled for you more or less for free, success is just a matter of gaining mindshare. It has been happening for a while with blogs, YouTube, HN/Reddit comments. For an example just look at reposts. Pick the right title, be the right submitter, get the right first commenter, and some blog spam article has hundreds of votes on the front page while the original source goes without any votes or comments. Just on the app store, money is involved instead of karma.
MichaelApproved 15y ago
Sounds like this would make a better web page then an app. With the web, it's easier to share, there are far fewer rules, larger user base and if google has a problem with your logo, they can send you a detailed C&D letter which you can take care of without losing your existing work.
haliax 15y ago
Nice hack, and a cool way to get your feet wet with developing Android apps as a business.
Kwpolska 15y ago
You are crazy. Why didn't you do this through a bloody website? I'd be happier to get a G+ invite through my PC, easy and fast, rather than grabbing the phone, praying for the battery to be still alive, turn on WiFi/data connection, fire up Market, search for an app, download it, and THEN get my bloody invitation... yeah, I'd stay with the PC way. (originally as a comment under this blog post)

122 points by obviator 15y ago

I read your article and couldn't find an answer to "How to make $250 a day"

By attracting developers like this guy, Google is going to have a very hard time competing with Apple. The Android Market is filled with apps like this. More so than the iOS App Store by far.

0x12 15y ago
What do you think is wrong with it? 'Apps like this' apparently didn't exist, according to the article he searched for one. As far as I can see he simply filled a need. If google would be so kind as to state what their problem is with it, who knows, it might see a revival.
- rhygar 15y ago
  Android is "open" - so just about anything goes. It uses Java, that starter language for just about anyone who learns how to program these days. So you end up with an environment that is very conducive to spamware/adware type apps and people trying to get rich quick. It only takes a few bad apps before it becomes like Windows, where users are afraid to install anything new or off-brand.
  - jamesbritt 15y ago
    before it becomes like Windows, where users are afraid to install anything new or off-brand. Is that even true? I keep hearing how Windows users are not selective enough about what they install.
    - alanh 15y ago
      Sure, but it’s true for some people. Wasn’t there a story about someone’s mom who was afraid to install programs on the PC but enjoys installing apps to her new iPad? Now substitute a Galaxy Tab for the iPad and have her read a story about Android app malware in her Reader’s Digest.
      - rblackwater 15y ago
        Fantastic results like these are why scientific studies all use "someone's mom" as a sample size.
  - 0x12 15y ago
    That doesn't address at all what is specifically wrong with this particular app, other than possibly the logo.
  - there 15y ago
    right, because nobody ever made fart apps and other tacky shit in objective c.
    - jamesbritt 15y ago
      Plus a common complaint about android is the app dev environment and tools suck compared to iOS. People interested in creating crap seem to find a way, platform notwithstanding.
      - woodall 15y ago
        Because I do not have a Mac(and cannot run OSX in a VM) I am kind of left out in the cold when it comes to developing apps for the iOS. Granted, the Android SDK can, at times, be a bit wonky(sometimes taking as long as 10 mins to boot into a VM) it is still there and available to all platforms. To say it sucks is a pretty tall order.
        obviator 15y ago
        I agree. The barrier to entry for developing iOS apps is too high for me, as I'd have to buy a Mac and, realistically speaking, an iOS device for testing. But I can run the Android SDK on all my computers, Windows & Linux alike, so development is available wherever I am. Also, the Android SDK works really well for testing with a physical device. Plug in by USB, or use wireless ADB, and it only takes a couple of seconds to deploy a debug package to your testing device. Much faster than using the emulator.
        jamesbritt 15y ago
        "To say it sucks is a pretty tall order." I agree, but look through past posts on hn and see if this isn't a oft-mentined opinion.
  - jonknee 15y ago
    > that starter language for just about anyone who learns how to program these days It's also the language that most big businesses run on these days. It's popular to learn because it's used many places (e.g. useful). Language has nothing to do with it. The iTunes App Store is riddled with comically bad apps and that's never going to change. NetFlix is also riddled with horrible movies, it's the nature of the business.
  - kokey 15y ago
    I actually had a dream last night that I was sent a video that I viewed on my Mac, and only after running it realized it was a trojan. In my dream I felt stupid and also amused at the fact that there are Mac trojans. Then I woke up from my dream, and remembered the trojan wouldn't have been able to run without asking me first and wouldn't have been able to install anything with asking me to type in my password.
deleted 15y ago
[deleted]

Mizza 15y ago

This is a really scammy website - I really don't like it. The goal shouldn't be to make money with Android - it should be to make interesting and high quality software products for your customers. I should also mention that I make more than $1000 a month, the site's goal, by selling Android apps.

jpulgarin 15y ago
Why shouldn't the goal be to make money with Android?
- Mizza 15y ago
  Because if that's your only goal, you end up producing low-quality, mass-produced garbage - "shovelware" - and that's no way to go through life, in my opinion.
  - daleharvey 15y ago
    1. Its pretty presumptious to be telling people what their life goals are 2. Making quality products is not mutually exclusive from building quality products, I hate to bring them up as an example but not many people could argue that apple produces mass produced garbage, and they do fairly well on the money side.
  - jamesbritt 15y ago
    Does "low-quality, mass-produced garbage" make a developer more money than quality apps? I'm skeptical, but I don't have figures. Still, a race to the bottom and near-zero margins, because crap is easy to replicate, seems like a bad plan for real profits.
    - Mizza 15y ago
      In the long run, no, I don't think low quality apps make more money than by high quality ones. But that's not to say that there isn't any money to be made by selling garbage. I'm not saying that it's bad to make money - quite the opposite! All I'm saying is that shitty software sucks. Writing it sucks, selling it sucks, buying it sucks and using it sucks. Build cool stuff instead.

nohat 15y ago

Another possible motivation for google suspending the app was that it abused the google plus invitation system. That probably isn't explicitly against the rules of the android market place, but it probably is against the rules or at least intention of google plus, and there has to be some protective bleed over from other google properties.

ig1 15y ago

Here's a simple rule: Don't use someone-else's trademark as the fist word of your product name. The first word is typically used to imply endorsement or officialness. So for example Microsoft X or Google Y. If you build a product based on a third party service, you can generally use the trademark in your name for example "Bob's invites to Google+", as long as it's clear it's not an officially produced or endorsed product.

robryan 15y ago
With Google though you would ideally want to avoid it altogether, although in this case that wouldn't really be possible. A lot of Google logos have specific terms of use, most of which include that they can't be modified in any way which I thinking might have resulted in the ban in this case.

benregenspan 15y ago

"Big corporations don’t understand, even if you’re 'trying to do the right thing'." Really? This guy was making money by offering a dubious service leveraging someone else's brand. As he admits, it was an experiment and the way he conducted it was very ill-advised. Own up to it, don't whine about not being "understood".

DanielBMarkham 15y ago

Damn. Talk about targeted content. The guy writes an article on a failed Android experiment, makes the front page of HN. I click on the link and I'm on a blog with 32 articles in the last couple of months, all highly-targeted at Android developers. Android book ads on the side. All very nicely put-together (I know some folks would consider my analysis an attack. It is not.) This guy is either going to make money on Android apps or make money advertising about them! I like the app idea, but the story shows something really sad about these app marketplaces -- there's so much social engineering it's not funny. The right name, the right logo, the right first customers, the right momentum -- if the die come up the right way, you're on a roll. But if something happens to mess up one or two aspects of it? It can all fall apart. Or to put another way people buying the app are the number one signal for other people to buy the app. So it's kind of a weird little high-stakes popularity contest, at least as far as I can tell. I just think it's cool that the author took the failed app idea, turned it around into a blog entry, and then might make a few bucks on that. Having the targeted blog to go along with your app efforts was very smart. If nothing else, as long as you keep trying, even if you go through a hundred ideas which never pan out, you could end up with a nice ebook out of all of it one day. Call it something like "How to win by failing"

ansy 15y ago
Regarding your social engineering comment, I think this is a side effect of digital content distribution in general. With all the scaling handled for you more or less for free, success is just a matter of gaining mindshare. It has been happening for a while with blogs, YouTube, HN/Reddit comments. For an example just look at reposts. Pick the right title, be the right submitter, get the right first commenter, and some blog spam article has hundreds of votes on the front page while the original source goes without any votes or comments. Just on the app store, money is involved instead of karma.

MichaelApproved 15y ago

Sounds like this would make a better web page then an app. With the web, it's easier to share, there are far fewer rules, larger user base and if google has a problem with your logo, they can send you a detailed C&D letter which you can take care of without losing your existing work.

haliax 15y ago

Nice hack, and a cool way to get your feet wet with developing Android apps as a business.

Kwpolska 15y ago

You are crazy. Why didn't you do this through a bloody website? I'd be happier to get a G+ invite through my PC, easy and fast, rather than grabbing the phone, praying for the battery to be still alive, turn on WiFi/data connection, fire up Market, search for an app, download it, and THEN get my bloody invitation... yeah, I'd stay with the PC way. (originally as a comment under this blog post)