10 ms·

Take careful notice of the restriction hidden behind an "i" icon on https://vercel.com/pricing https://vercel.com/pricing that you can have max 10 users on the

by jSherz 5y ago

Take careful notice of the restriction hidden behind an "i" icon on https://vercel.com/pricing https://vercel.com/pricing that you can have max 10 users on the Pro plan before your frontend team has to have a sheepish conversation about how much the Enterprise tier is.

detaro 5y ago
oof, that's ugly to hide like that.
- tomrod 5y ago
  Indeed. Hey enterprise sales folks. If you want me to use your enterprise services, post your prices. We're all adults here. If I can't afford your offering and you still want my business, we can work out a discount. If you're going to make me hop through hoops to find or determine pricing, you go directly to the bottom of my comparison list, and possibly leave it altogether. If you're truly the only option in market you _might_ make it if I can't afford to build your service. Stop foggy pricing. We've known since at least 2013 this is a bad economic practice. [0] Miravete, E.J., 2013. Competition and the use of foggy pricing. American Economic Journal: Microeconomics, 5(1), pp.194-216.
  - ushakov 5y ago
    that's not how enterprise sales work if you want them to have your business, then you have to post your budget it's a great way to filter out orgs that have no money to begin with and big businesses might be paranoid about their competitors knowing their costs
    - tomrod 5y ago
      > if you want their business, then you have to post your budget Getting someone's business means they are paying you.
      - tomrod 5y ago
        Note: parent comment to my comment stealth edited, in case anyone else noted the difference in quote and comment. Point understood regardless. Basically enterprise sales are unwilling to sell a product, would prefer to sell an associated labor cost. My prioritization remains though. If you obfuscate price, I want as little to do with your product as possible.
        ushakov 5y ago
        it might look like a terrible practice, but in reality it actually is a funnel if you don't have serious money lined up (typically 5-6 numbers minimum) sales won't bother with you anyways sometimes pricing can't be easily calculated and there might be many factors and even some custom agreements in place (like SLAs), which do add up the cost substantially in my own projects, however i always list minimum commitment for every tier but only because i don't have enterprise sales team
        detaro 5y ago
        I don't care about having enterprise sales as much as about the "hide stuff behind bubbles" design, but it's still also interesting that here we talk a scenario where you easily could reach the "call enterprise sales" point with <$1000 monthly spend, which feels kind of absurd. One can hope the answer is an uncomplicated "ok, we'll unlock more contributors for another $20 per person", because anything else would be a waste of sales-people-time, but still...
  - webdeployer 5y ago
    Can't fleece you for as much as possible if you know the pricing ahead of time
  - tootie 5y ago
    That's usually not really practical. Even businesses that have transparent pricing by usage still have enterprise sales teams and their customers always want to negotiate. Usage patterns are all unique. Sometimes you can offer non-monetary value like case studies, beta testing, or some sort of in-kind service. You can trade on commitment times versus price per transaction or price per user or whatever. There's no easy way around it.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - tomrod 5y ago
      A top comment from reddit's sysadmin forum that is apropos: > If SpaceX can list pricing for launching a payload into space on their website, you can do the same for your [...] software. If I want to use your software as-is without access to your developers to prioritize features, there isn't a need for "enterprise" approaches.
      - tootie 5y ago
        Like I said, even places that list prices want you to negotiate. The list prices above a certain threshold are typically higher than most enterprises are actually paying because the get discounts in exchange for commitments or other considerations. True of all the public cloud providers.
ushakov 5y ago
also you can't use the free tier for any commercial activities
- goatherders 5y ago
  NOt sure I understand how anyone could have a problem with that.
  - ushakov 5y ago
    non-profits?
    - archeroed 5y ago
      I read earlier today on their website that they were offering free plans to open source projects, aybe they also do it for non profit
      - leerob 5y ago
        Correct, we support a number of non-profits as well.
  - erebearalte 5y ago
    I actually once switched to netlify cause their free tier allows commercial sites, the websites i made in this situation are pretty local and small and I doubt vercel would even notice but it was easier to just switch to netlify than research all the reasons why those websites can be considered commercial.
tomnipotent 5y ago
Ten front-end engineers will probably cover 95% of businesses out there, and at that point it's not a difficult conversation to have any more than asking for PyCharm licenses. They could totally replace the icon with just a (Max 10).
- jSherz 5y ago
  I have no quarms with tiers of pricing or restrictions, if that information is presented clearly. The current UI feels like a sneaky dark pattern.
rustc 5y ago
Is the bandwidth pricing also really so high after you hit the 1TB limit? It shows $20 for the first TB, then $55/100GB. That's a 27.5x increase while other cloud services reduce the prices on higher tiers.
- Aeolun 5y ago
  $20 for the first TB is already expensive.

by jSherz 5y ago

detaro 5y ago

oof, that's ugly to hide like that.

tomrod 5y ago
Indeed. Hey enterprise sales folks. If you want me to use your enterprise services, post your prices. We're all adults here. If I can't afford your offering and you still want my business, we can work out a discount. If you're going to make me hop through hoops to find or determine pricing, you go directly to the bottom of my comparison list, and possibly leave it altogether. If you're truly the only option in market you _might_ make it if I can't afford to build your service. Stop foggy pricing. We've known since at least 2013 this is a bad economic practice. [0] Miravete, E.J., 2013. Competition and the use of foggy pricing. American Economic Journal: Microeconomics, 5(1), pp.194-216.
- ushakov 5y ago
  that's not how enterprise sales work if you want them to have your business, then you have to post your budget it's a great way to filter out orgs that have no money to begin with and big businesses might be paranoid about their competitors knowing their costs
  - tomrod 5y ago
    > if you want their business, then you have to post your budget Getting someone's business means they are paying you.
    - tomrod 5y ago
      Note: parent comment to my comment stealth edited, in case anyone else noted the difference in quote and comment. Point understood regardless. Basically enterprise sales are unwilling to sell a product, would prefer to sell an associated labor cost. My prioritization remains though. If you obfuscate price, I want as little to do with your product as possible.
      - ushakov 5y ago
        it might look like a terrible practice, but in reality it actually is a funnel if you don't have serious money lined up (typically 5-6 numbers minimum) sales won't bother with you anyways sometimes pricing can't be easily calculated and there might be many factors and even some custom agreements in place (like SLAs), which do add up the cost substantially in my own projects, however i always list minimum commitment for every tier but only because i don't have enterprise sales team
        detaro 5y ago
        I don't care about having enterprise sales as much as about the "hide stuff behind bubbles" design, but it's still also interesting that here we talk a scenario where you easily could reach the "call enterprise sales" point with <$1000 monthly spend, which feels kind of absurd. One can hope the answer is an uncomplicated "ok, we'll unlock more contributors for another $20 per person", because anything else would be a waste of sales-people-time, but still...
- webdeployer 5y ago
  Can't fleece you for as much as possible if you know the pricing ahead of time
- tootie 5y ago
  That's usually not really practical. Even businesses that have transparent pricing by usage still have enterprise sales teams and their customers always want to negotiate. Usage patterns are all unique. Sometimes you can offer non-monetary value like case studies, beta testing, or some sort of in-kind service. You can trade on commitment times versus price per transaction or price per user or whatever. There's no easy way around it.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - tomrod 5y ago
    A top comment from reddit's sysadmin forum that is apropos: > If SpaceX can list pricing for launching a payload into space on their website, you can do the same for your [...] software. If I want to use your software as-is without access to your developers to prioritize features, there isn't a need for "enterprise" approaches.
    - tootie 5y ago
      Like I said, even places that list prices want you to negotiate. The list prices above a certain threshold are typically higher than most enterprises are actually paying because the get discounts in exchange for commitments or other considerations. True of all the public cloud providers.

ushakov 5y ago

also you can't use the free tier for any commercial activities

goatherders 5y ago
NOt sure I understand how anyone could have a problem with that.
- ushakov 5y ago
  non-profits?
  - archeroed 5y ago
    I read earlier today on their website that they were offering free plans to open source projects, aybe they also do it for non profit
    - leerob 5y ago
      Correct, we support a number of non-profits as well.
- erebearalte 5y ago
  I actually once switched to netlify cause their free tier allows commercial sites, the websites i made in this situation are pretty local and small and I doubt vercel would even notice but it was easier to just switch to netlify than research all the reasons why those websites can be considered commercial.

tomnipotent 5y ago

Ten front-end engineers will probably cover 95% of businesses out there, and at that point it's not a difficult conversation to have any more than asking for PyCharm licenses. They could totally replace the icon with just a (Max 10).

jSherz 5y ago
I have no quarms with tiers of pricing or restrictions, if that information is presented clearly. The current UI feels like a sneaky dark pattern.

rustc 5y ago

Is the bandwidth pricing also really so high after you hit the 1TB limit? It shows $20 for the first TB, then $55/100GB. That's a 27.5x increase while other cloud services reduce the prices on higher tiers.

Aeolun 5y ago
$20 for the first TB is already expensive.