6 ms·

This brings back fond memories. When I came back from CCC Camp 2003, OpenBSD got me interested. So I gave it a try, and had a real fun time in the ensuing 12

This brings back fond memories. When I came back from CCC Camp 2003, OpenBSD got me interested. So I gave it a try, and had a real fun time in the ensuing 12 months. The simplicity, pretty good docs and the installer ("Do you want to edit /etc/hosts with ed now?") got me really hooked. I eventually didnt make it away from Linux for several reasons, but I still miss playing with OpenBSD. It felt so right and unbloated, something I cant say about Linux anymore these days.

foxfluff 5y ago
Does Alpine Linux feel bloated too?
- mlang23 5y ago
  No idea, never tried. I went from SuSE straight to Debian, and haven't bothered to check any other distros out since.
  - foxfluff 5y ago
    Well, if you ever have the time to give it a try.. Alpine is the most OpenBSD-like Linux distro I've yet to see. Of course, it's still not OpenBSD.
    - opan 5y ago
      What about Void? It even used LibreSSL out of the box for a while.
      - foxfluff 5y ago
        I'm not super fond of rolling releases. It always feels weird when people recommend Arch or Void to an OpenBSD user. OpenBSD has very nice releases with a tested & documented update process between each.
        raspbeguy 5y ago
        OpenBSD has the -current branch, which is actually a rolling release
        Shared404 5y ago
        And one of the most common pieces of advice I've seen for desktop OpenBSD is to use -current . I don't on desktop because I haven't needed to, and wouldn't want to on a server though.
- enriquto 5y ago
  It's much better than monstrosities like debian and the like, but still more bloated than OpenBSD. I have raw installs of OpenBSD 6.9 and Alpine on virtual machines. Running "ps ax" fills half of my terminal screen on OpenBSD, and requires several screens on Alpine.
  - foxfluff 5y ago
    Well, ps on linux shows kernel threads whereas on OpenBSD it doesn't. The list is pretty short on my alpine install if you exclude kernel threads: # ps ax | grep -v ']$' PID USER TIME COMMAND 1 root 0:01 /sbin/init 1985 root 0:00 /sbin/udevd 2361 root 0:00 /sbin/syslogd -t 2387 root 0:00 supervise-daemon wpa_supplicant --start /sbin/wpa_supplicant -- -i wlan0 -c/etc/wpa_supplicant/wpa_supplicant.conf 2388 root 0:00 /sbin/wpa_supplicant -i wlan0 -c/etc/wpa_supplicant/wpa_supplicant.conf 2473 root 0:00 /sbin/udhcpc -b -R -p /var/run/udhcpc.wlan0.pid -i wlan0 -x hostname:pi4 2567 chrony 0:00 /usr/sbin/chronyd -f /etc/chrony/chrony.conf 2592 root 0:00 /usr/sbin/crond -c /etc/crontabs 2621 root 0:00 sshd: /usr/sbin/sshd [listener] 0 of 10-100 startups 2652 root 0:00 /sbin/getty 38400 tty1 2653 root 0:00 /sbin/getty 38400 tty2 2654 root 0:00 /sbin/getty 38400 tty3 2655 root 0:00 /sbin/getty 38400 tty4 2656 root 0:00 /sbin/getty 38400 tty5 2657 root 0:00 /sbin/getty 38400 tty6 3099 root 0:00 sshd: root@pts/0 3102 root 0:00 -ash 3109 root 0:00 ps ax 3110 root 0:00 grep -v ]$ I don't think kernel threads are a good measure of bloat. And a base install of Alpine is smaller than OpenBSD. But that's a fair point about presentation. OpenBSD seems to be more 'quiet' by default, and tends to only show relevant information. dmesg on OpenBSD seems much cleaner compared to the mess that Linux outputs.
    - formerly_proven 5y ago
      > I don't think kernel threads are a good measure of bloat. It kinda is. Totally unrelated, but there is nothing quite like seeing hundreds of [nfsd] tasks hard-blocking in D on each server in a cluster. Time to reboot... well... everything.
    - enriquto 5y ago
zibzab 5y ago
I think Arch is very close to the OpenBSD philosophy. Not necessarily for security reasons, but more as a byproduct of keeping things simple so we can manage them manually.
- raspbeguy 5y ago
  I do not fully agree on this statement. Arch uses systemd which cannot be caled "keeping things simple" in my opinion. I think Voidlinux is a bit closer to what you description.
  - HeckFeck 5y ago
    Void was created by a former NetBSD contributor, if I am not mistaken. Xbps, its packager, is a breeze to use. And I've found no major qualms with runit, the init system.
  - LargoLasskhyfv 5y ago
    Then use one of the derivatives. Obarun, Artix come to mind.
    - raspbeguy 5y ago
      I don't need to.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

foxfluff 5y ago

Does Alpine Linux feel bloated too?

mlang23 5y ago
No idea, never tried. I went from SuSE straight to Debian, and haven't bothered to check any other distros out since.
- foxfluff 5y ago
  Well, if you ever have the time to give it a try.. Alpine is the most OpenBSD-like Linux distro I've yet to see. Of course, it's still not OpenBSD.
  - opan 5y ago
    What about Void? It even used LibreSSL out of the box for a while.
    - foxfluff 5y ago
      I'm not super fond of rolling releases. It always feels weird when people recommend Arch or Void to an OpenBSD user. OpenBSD has very nice releases with a tested & documented update process between each.
      - raspbeguy 5y ago
        OpenBSD has the -current branch, which is actually a rolling release
        Shared404 5y ago
        And one of the most common pieces of advice I've seen for desktop OpenBSD is to use -current . I don't on desktop because I haven't needed to, and wouldn't want to on a server though.
enriquto 5y ago
It's much better than monstrosities like debian and the like, but still more bloated than OpenBSD. I have raw installs of OpenBSD 6.9 and Alpine on virtual machines. Running "ps ax" fills half of my terminal screen on OpenBSD, and requires several screens on Alpine.
- foxfluff 5y ago
  Well, ps on linux shows kernel threads whereas on OpenBSD it doesn't. The list is pretty short on my alpine install if you exclude kernel threads: # ps ax | grep -v ']$' PID USER TIME COMMAND 1 root 0:01 /sbin/init 1985 root 0:00 /sbin/udevd 2361 root 0:00 /sbin/syslogd -t 2387 root 0:00 supervise-daemon wpa_supplicant --start /sbin/wpa_supplicant -- -i wlan0 -c/etc/wpa_supplicant/wpa_supplicant.conf 2388 root 0:00 /sbin/wpa_supplicant -i wlan0 -c/etc/wpa_supplicant/wpa_supplicant.conf 2473 root 0:00 /sbin/udhcpc -b -R -p /var/run/udhcpc.wlan0.pid -i wlan0 -x hostname:pi4 2567 chrony 0:00 /usr/sbin/chronyd -f /etc/chrony/chrony.conf 2592 root 0:00 /usr/sbin/crond -c /etc/crontabs 2621 root 0:00 sshd: /usr/sbin/sshd [listener] 0 of 10-100 startups 2652 root 0:00 /sbin/getty 38400 tty1 2653 root 0:00 /sbin/getty 38400 tty2 2654 root 0:00 /sbin/getty 38400 tty3 2655 root 0:00 /sbin/getty 38400 tty4 2656 root 0:00 /sbin/getty 38400 tty5 2657 root 0:00 /sbin/getty 38400 tty6 3099 root 0:00 sshd: root@pts/0 3102 root 0:00 -ash 3109 root 0:00 ps ax 3110 root 0:00 grep -v ]$ I don't think kernel threads are a good measure of bloat. And a base install of Alpine is smaller than OpenBSD. But that's a fair point about presentation. OpenBSD seems to be more 'quiet' by default, and tends to only show relevant information. dmesg on OpenBSD seems much cleaner compared to the mess that Linux outputs.
  - formerly_proven 5y ago
    > I don't think kernel threads are a good measure of bloat. It kinda is. Totally unrelated, but there is nothing quite like seeing hundreds of [nfsd] tasks hard-blocking in D on each server in a cluster. Time to reboot... well... everything.
  - enriquto 5y ago

zibzab 5y ago

I think Arch is very close to the OpenBSD philosophy. Not necessarily for security reasons, but more as a byproduct of keeping things simple so we can manage them manually.

raspbeguy 5y ago
I do not fully agree on this statement. Arch uses systemd which cannot be caled "keeping things simple" in my opinion. I think Voidlinux is a bit closer to what you description.
- HeckFeck 5y ago
  Void was created by a former NetBSD contributor, if I am not mistaken. Xbps, its packager, is a breeze to use. And I've found no major qualms with runit, the init system.
- LargoLasskhyfv 5y ago
  Then use one of the derivatives. Obarun, Artix come to mind.
  - raspbeguy 5y ago
    I don't need to.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]