5 ms·

These transactions are not occurring on the bitcoin network - they are occurring on the lightning network which is a second layer on top of the base bitcoin lay

by Centmo 5y ago

These transactions are not occurring on the bitcoin network - they are occurring on the lightning network which is a second layer on top of the base bitcoin layer. Transactions here are virtually free and use virtually no energy. This is how bitcoin scales for many small transactions.

kd913 5y ago
Transactions on the lightning network have difficulty scaling because each node needs to what compute the entire graph/nodes and setup channels? A problem which scales even worse the more nodes in play. https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoincash/comments/8n9xbp/why_the_lightning_network_doesnt_scale/ https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoincash/comments/8n9xbp/why_the...
- panarky 5y ago
  The lightning node running on my Raspberry Pi doesn't have any trouble finding routes so it can't be too compute-intensive. Most transactions settle in two seconds or less for a fraction of a cent in fees.
- stimpson_j_cat 5y ago
  The only knowledge you have of the lightning network is a YouTube video from 3 years ago posted on a subreddit with a financial interest in badmouthing BTC?
  - NicoJuicy 5y ago
    So, what is not correct in the video?
    - 0x000000001 5y ago
      Pretty much all of it
      - NicoJuicy 5y ago
        Specify
        deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
        stimpson_j_cat 5y ago
        LN has 75k channels right now and 3k BTC locked https://1ml.com/ https://1ml.com/ Did the GP provide any specific reason why LN can't scale other than "here's a link to youtube from 2018?"
        NicoJuicy 5y ago
        I'm not really sure if this is the proof I'm looking for. The author of the video was explaining how the LN works and it seems to be an exponential routing calculation problem ( similar to traveling salesman ) So while it could work for 75 k channels, it's not going to work for 1 million. If the explanation of that video is correct (since you didn't disagree that), then how many channels it has now is irrelevant from my POV.
        NicoJuicy 5y ago
        Found this, so i believe it's still a valid problem: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16155835 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16155835
duud 5y ago
If I want to remit US$100 from the US to someone in El Salvador and they want USD cash, how much is going to be left after all is said and done?
- anonomousename 5y ago
  On the original network - about an hour and a half and ~$9. On the lightning network (layer 2) it would be about $0.09 and take less than a minute.
  - nextaccountic 5y ago
    An hour and a half? But there are new blocks every 10 minutes!
    - jakopo87 5y ago
      Transactions are confirmed when they are at least 6 blocks deep to avoid double spending. https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Confirmation https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Confirmation
      - nextaccountic 5y ago
        Confirmed by who? Coinbase currently requires only 3 confirmations[0]. Binance requires only 1 confirmation for deposits and 2 for withdraw[1]. Actually. Was there a successful double spend in Bitcoin ever? I mean, this kind of attack can't be done in secret, right? Such attack wold immediately make the news, because the blockchain is public. And to pull it off you need a substantial % of the mining capacity, so only a handful entities in world can coordinate such high hashrate attack. It just doesn't seem very likely, and specially not if you're just reversing a low value retail purchase. I'd wager the rate of counterfeit money you receive when dealing with cash is way higher. [0] https://help.coinbase.com/en/coinbase/getting-started/crypto-education/bitcoin-glossary https://help.coinbase.com/en/coinbase/getting-started/crypto... "Coinbase requires 3 confirmations to consider a bitcoin transaction final." [1] https://finance.yahoo.com/news/binance-cuts-time-needed-btc-101118595.html https://finance.yahoo.com/news/binance-cuts-time-needed-btc-...

by Centmo 5y ago

kd913 5y ago

Transactions on the lightning network have difficulty scaling because each node needs to what compute the entire graph/nodes and setup channels? A problem which scales even worse the more nodes in play. https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoincash/comments/8n9xbp/why_the_lightning_network_doesnt_scale/ https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoincash/comments/8n9xbp/why_the...

panarky 5y ago
The lightning node running on my Raspberry Pi doesn't have any trouble finding routes so it can't be too compute-intensive. Most transactions settle in two seconds or less for a fraction of a cent in fees.
stimpson_j_cat 5y ago
The only knowledge you have of the lightning network is a YouTube video from 3 years ago posted on a subreddit with a financial interest in badmouthing BTC?
- NicoJuicy 5y ago
  So, what is not correct in the video?
  - 0x000000001 5y ago
    Pretty much all of it
    - NicoJuicy 5y ago
      Specify
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
      - stimpson_j_cat 5y ago
        LN has 75k channels right now and 3k BTC locked https://1ml.com/ https://1ml.com/ Did the GP provide any specific reason why LN can't scale other than "here's a link to youtube from 2018?"
        NicoJuicy 5y ago
        I'm not really sure if this is the proof I'm looking for. The author of the video was explaining how the LN works and it seems to be an exponential routing calculation problem ( similar to traveling salesman ) So while it could work for 75 k channels, it's not going to work for 1 million. If the explanation of that video is correct (since you didn't disagree that), then how many channels it has now is irrelevant from my POV.
        NicoJuicy 5y ago
        Found this, so i believe it's still a valid problem: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16155835 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16155835

duud 5y ago

If I want to remit US$100 from the US to someone in El Salvador and they want USD cash, how much is going to be left after all is said and done?

anonomousename 5y ago
On the original network - about an hour and a half and ~$9. On the lightning network (layer 2) it would be about $0.09 and take less than a minute.
- nextaccountic 5y ago
  An hour and a half? But there are new blocks every 10 minutes!
  - jakopo87 5y ago
    Transactions are confirmed when they are at least 6 blocks deep to avoid double spending. https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Confirmation https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Confirmation
    - nextaccountic 5y ago
      Confirmed by who? Coinbase currently requires only 3 confirmations[0]. Binance requires only 1 confirmation for deposits and 2 for withdraw[1]. Actually. Was there a successful double spend in Bitcoin ever? I mean, this kind of attack can't be done in secret, right? Such attack wold immediately make the news, because the blockchain is public. And to pull it off you need a substantial % of the mining capacity, so only a handful entities in world can coordinate such high hashrate attack. It just doesn't seem very likely, and specially not if you're just reversing a low value retail purchase. I'd wager the rate of counterfeit money you receive when dealing with cash is way higher. [0] https://help.coinbase.com/en/coinbase/getting-started/crypto-education/bitcoin-glossary https://help.coinbase.com/en/coinbase/getting-started/crypto... "Coinbase requires 3 confirmations to consider a bitcoin transaction final." [1] https://finance.yahoo.com/news/binance-cuts-time-needed-btc-101118595.html https://finance.yahoo.com/news/binance-cuts-time-needed-btc-...