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Because obesity will kill them. That's the message that's not being said in a COVID context. Healthy at every size is one of the biggest health lies in America

jasonlaramburu 5y ago
>Because obesity will kill them. That's the message that's not being said in a COVID context. Heart disease is the leading cause of death in America, and obesity is the #1 risk factor for it. This message has been clear and emphasized since the 1970s. Despite messaging, obesity has gotten worse, not better. You are wrong and oversimplifying the problem if you think COVID can be solved by telling people to lose weight.
- CryptoPunk 5y ago
  That message can be reinforced in the context of COVID, given obesity is the leading preventable risk factor for COVID. Instead, a huge number of people are laser focused on rationalizing the imposition of mandates, especially on extremely low-risk group, even children.
  - edanm 5y ago
    It's really not an either-or situation. You can encourage people to be generally healthier, and also encourage them to get vaccinated (or force them). And if you compare the two, the vaccine is much closer to a magic cure - it's very dependable and takes "1 month" to work (assuming a two shot vaccine). Whereas encouraging people to be less obese is both incredibly hard (as decades of campaigns prove), and even in the best case scenario, would take a long time for most people.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - CryptoPunk 5y ago
      People should definitely be encouraged to get vaccinated too, I agree. But there should be no institutionalized discrimination against the unvaccinated, just as we shouldn't discriminate against the obese to encourage them to eat less.
mbfg 5y ago
if i'm fat, my fat won't jump onto you and kill you.
- CryptoPunk 5y ago
  COVID vaccines don't stop transmission, so don't protect other people.
  - mbfg 5y ago
    For individuals this is true, for populations this is false.
    - CryptoPunk 5y ago
      No, it is true for populations as well. Herd immunity via vaccination is not possible: https://twitter.com/eliaseythorsson/status/1424011542195023878?s=20 https://twitter.com/eliaseythorsson/status/14240115421950238...
      - jasonlaramburu 5y ago
        This is a misleading interpretation of the data in Iceland. According to the parent link, 18 people are hospitalized there, compared to ~80,000 in the US. Adjusted for population, that is a >75% lower overall hospitalization rate. Infection rates in unvaccinated are also more than 2x vaccinated in Iceland. Unless you misinterpret the data, it is undeniable that vaccines reduce transmission and incidence of severe disease. https://apnews.com/article/fact-checking-954838214391 https://apnews.com/article/fact-checking-954838214391
        CryptoPunk 5y ago
        The higher rates of death and serious illness among the unvaccinated has nothing to do with what I was arguing. You are willfully misinterpreting my argument. I was arguing that given Iceland, at almost full vaccination, is having its biggest COVID wave yet, means full vaccination does not provide herd immunity, and thus every one will eventually get exposed to COVID irrespective of the vaccination rate. So you can't make a sound argument that other people's decision to get the vaccine is increasing other people's chance of being exposed to COVID.

jasonlaramburu 5y ago

>Because obesity will kill them. That's the message that's not being said in a COVID context. Heart disease is the leading cause of death in America, and obesity is the #1 risk factor for it. This message has been clear and emphasized since the 1970s. Despite messaging, obesity has gotten worse, not better. You are wrong and oversimplifying the problem if you think COVID can be solved by telling people to lose weight.

CryptoPunk 5y ago
That message can be reinforced in the context of COVID, given obesity is the leading preventable risk factor for COVID. Instead, a huge number of people are laser focused on rationalizing the imposition of mandates, especially on extremely low-risk group, even children.
- edanm 5y ago
  It's really not an either-or situation. You can encourage people to be generally healthier, and also encourage them to get vaccinated (or force them). And if you compare the two, the vaccine is much closer to a magic cure - it's very dependable and takes "1 month" to work (assuming a two shot vaccine). Whereas encouraging people to be less obese is both incredibly hard (as decades of campaigns prove), and even in the best case scenario, would take a long time for most people.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - CryptoPunk 5y ago
    People should definitely be encouraged to get vaccinated too, I agree. But there should be no institutionalized discrimination against the unvaccinated, just as we shouldn't discriminate against the obese to encourage them to eat less.

mbfg 5y ago

if i'm fat, my fat won't jump onto you and kill you.

CryptoPunk 5y ago
COVID vaccines don't stop transmission, so don't protect other people.
- mbfg 5y ago
  For individuals this is true, for populations this is false.
  - CryptoPunk 5y ago
    No, it is true for populations as well. Herd immunity via vaccination is not possible: https://twitter.com/eliaseythorsson/status/1424011542195023878?s=20 https://twitter.com/eliaseythorsson/status/14240115421950238...
    - jasonlaramburu 5y ago
      This is a misleading interpretation of the data in Iceland. According to the parent link, 18 people are hospitalized there, compared to ~80,000 in the US. Adjusted for population, that is a >75% lower overall hospitalization rate. Infection rates in unvaccinated are also more than 2x vaccinated in Iceland. Unless you misinterpret the data, it is undeniable that vaccines reduce transmission and incidence of severe disease. https://apnews.com/article/fact-checking-954838214391 https://apnews.com/article/fact-checking-954838214391
      - CryptoPunk 5y ago
        The higher rates of death and serious illness among the unvaccinated has nothing to do with what I was arguing. You are willfully misinterpreting my argument. I was arguing that given Iceland, at almost full vaccination, is having its biggest COVID wave yet, means full vaccination does not provide herd immunity, and thus every one will eventually get exposed to COVID irrespective of the vaccination rate. So you can't make a sound argument that other people's decision to get the vaccine is increasing other people's chance of being exposed to COVID.