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I hate to be that guy, but... Why should we have every single blog post by EJ on top stories here on HN? Why is "how she feels today" so important and still re

by Mafana0 15y ago

I hate to be that guy, but... Why should we have every single blog post by EJ on top stories here on HN? Why is "how she feels today" so important and still relevant? She caused all the drama and blamed Airbnb for something she is more responsible about than Airbnb. Airbnb did the right thing after all, some think that it's late, I don't. I'm just pissed about the attention that we give to her words. I won't be surprised if she authors a book to talk about how "Airbnb should have responded much more quickly to my urgent pleas for help, that they should have communicated with more sensitivity, and that they should have taken decisive action to help me feel safe during what has been a desperate time.". Come on, stop blaming them, they didn't make your "integrity being called into question", and your "character publicly trashed". You did.

kyro 15y ago
Yeah, she's received more than her fair share of sympathy.
hk43 15y ago
I already have -7 points and I am sure that this will also get downvoted but: AirBnB did not warn users - even so this was NOT the first case of a trashed home. THEY did know better, yet they never warned their users that this could happen. You might call this common sense, but their website paints the "we are all happy people" image, so they were actively trying to erode this common sense. Yes, they are partly to blame for this.
djcapelis 15y ago
It's on HN right now because it's an amazingly good and open discussion about how someone who was involved in a PR nightmare feels after it moves from being a story to being something in the past. If you read carefully, there are important lessons in PR and how to do good customer service embedded all around this story. There are lessons on crisis management, and yes, there are lessons on irrational human behavior and responses, especially in terms of how media attention, time and the reactions of others changes people's perspectives. I've found HN's comment section to be equally full of lessons on irrationality. From the person who is angry that EJ can't be satisfied to the person whose heart was still captured by her original story and unsatisfied by the outcome. These are how your customers respond when you do something wrong and are disappointed in you. For a site that focuses on startups, these lessons are worth seeing.
- Mafana0 15y ago
  Even though I do agree that the _whole_ story has some valuable PR lessons, I don't think that this particular blog post adds any value to this field. The story was worth keeping an eye on for entrepreneurs to take lessons from. But we had more than a dozen articles about it on HN, which is, for me, too much noise. You said that Airbnb was wrong and disappointing, I would argue that this wasn't mainly their fault, but that's out of our discussion point right now.
acangiano 15y ago
This being the internet, EJ has received an uncharacteristic amount of sympathy [1]. This is particularly true when considering that no pictures have been posted, so her eloquent writing was the only tool evoking emotional involvement and trust from the reader. My main issue with this post mortem is that, as you indirectly pointed out, it comes across as a bit self-entitled. Yes, AirBnB was slow to react and set things straight, but they still did the right thing, when they truly weren't obliged to. What happened to EJ is extremely unfortunate, but it was only marginally AirBnB's responsibility. Her public outcry and the consequent reaction of an anonymous crowd, was even less AirBnB's fault. In short, it's a sad story all around, and one that can be studied to learn valuable PR lessons. The outcome is as good as it's going to get though, whether EJ thinks it's adeguate or not, so it may not be a bad idea to move on. Of course she may not be in the right state of mind to come to that sensible conclusion. I truly feel sorry for her, but I won't look forward to "coming back here in search of answers to the many questions that loom large." 1. Deservedly so. Even though, I can't help but suspect that if the blogger was a guy, most people would have invited him to "grow a pair" from the very first post. Nevertheless, it's refreshing to see the outpour of support she has received.
pbreit 15y ago
I'd say you are "that" guy. This is indisputably an interesting story even if it wasn't YC's crown jewel (or, one of). This is what many bloggers do...they write about their experiences. Unlike some or even many, EJ was not writing to build HN karma. I think what she has written is plausibly reasonable. It would be easy to nit pick with some of the details.
- Dysiode 15y ago
  I think "that" guy trying more to say (and if he's not then I will) that yes, her story is extremely important, and she even mentions some of the benefits her suffering has had, however, it feels more as if she's whining for the attention. Some people don't need an arbitrary, transient number to feel good about themselves ;)
- Mafana0 15y ago
  Even if she's blogging about her experience, her feelings aren't relevant anymore, interesting story or not, we shouldn't care anymore, you can easily subscribe to her blog and read her words. I would never call her names, but it's obvious that she's enjoying all the fame and attention she's getting. God knows when she will stop complaining and thanking AirBnB and admit that they made it up for her generously, even though they were never obligated to. Some argue that what they did was only out of PR pressure. IMHO, that doesn't make them bad guys, working for your company reputation isn't a bad thing to do. EJ (and others) are still saying that AirBnB should have responded more quickly, for anyone who knows even the slightest bit about businesses and entrepreneurship, it's certain that this sort of insurance policy can't be done in hours, that needs days maybe weeks and they done it well. Does anyone think they should have shared their working details with her because she's writing post after post to complain about them so they don't sound like they don't care? Some do and that is very naïve actually. If you're implying that what I said was for karma, you can check my submissions/comments history, I'm more of a lurker here, I don't comment that much and I definitely don't care about karma (less than a dozen comments in 2 years). Thank you Dysiode, you've nicely clarify my point.
  - pbreit 15y ago

by Mafana0 15y ago

kyro 15y ago

Yeah, she's received more than her fair share of sympathy.

hk43 15y ago

I already have -7 points and I am sure that this will also get downvoted but: AirBnB did not warn users - even so this was NOT the first case of a trashed home. THEY did know better, yet they never warned their users that this could happen. You might call this common sense, but their website paints the "we are all happy people" image, so they were actively trying to erode this common sense. Yes, they are partly to blame for this.

djcapelis 15y ago

It's on HN right now because it's an amazingly good and open discussion about how someone who was involved in a PR nightmare feels after it moves from being a story to being something in the past. If you read carefully, there are important lessons in PR and how to do good customer service embedded all around this story. There are lessons on crisis management, and yes, there are lessons on irrational human behavior and responses, especially in terms of how media attention, time and the reactions of others changes people's perspectives. I've found HN's comment section to be equally full of lessons on irrationality. From the person who is angry that EJ can't be satisfied to the person whose heart was still captured by her original story and unsatisfied by the outcome. These are how your customers respond when you do something wrong and are disappointed in you. For a site that focuses on startups, these lessons are worth seeing.

Mafana0 15y ago
Even though I do agree that the _whole_ story has some valuable PR lessons, I don't think that this particular blog post adds any value to this field. The story was worth keeping an eye on for entrepreneurs to take lessons from. But we had more than a dozen articles about it on HN, which is, for me, too much noise. You said that Airbnb was wrong and disappointing, I would argue that this wasn't mainly their fault, but that's out of our discussion point right now.

acangiano 15y ago

This being the internet, EJ has received an uncharacteristic amount of sympathy [1]. This is particularly true when considering that no pictures have been posted, so her eloquent writing was the only tool evoking emotional involvement and trust from the reader. My main issue with this post mortem is that, as you indirectly pointed out, it comes across as a bit self-entitled. Yes, AirBnB was slow to react and set things straight, but they still did the right thing, when they truly weren't obliged to. What happened to EJ is extremely unfortunate, but it was only marginally AirBnB's responsibility. Her public outcry and the consequent reaction of an anonymous crowd, was even less AirBnB's fault. In short, it's a sad story all around, and one that can be studied to learn valuable PR lessons. The outcome is as good as it's going to get though, whether EJ thinks it's adeguate or not, so it may not be a bad idea to move on. Of course she may not be in the right state of mind to come to that sensible conclusion. I truly feel sorry for her, but I won't look forward to "coming back here in search of answers to the many questions that loom large." 1. Deservedly so. Even though, I can't help but suspect that if the blogger was a guy, most people would have invited him to "grow a pair" from the very first post. Nevertheless, it's refreshing to see the outpour of support she has received.

pbreit 15y ago

I'd say you are "that" guy. This is indisputably an interesting story even if it wasn't YC's crown jewel (or, one of). This is what many bloggers do...they write about their experiences. Unlike some or even many, EJ was not writing to build HN karma. I think what she has written is plausibly reasonable. It would be easy to nit pick with some of the details.

Dysiode 15y ago
I think "that" guy trying more to say (and if he's not then I will) that yes, her story is extremely important, and she even mentions some of the benefits her suffering has had, however, it feels more as if she's whining for the attention. Some people don't need an arbitrary, transient number to feel good about themselves ;)
Mafana0 15y ago
Even if she's blogging about her experience, her feelings aren't relevant anymore, interesting story or not, we shouldn't care anymore, you can easily subscribe to her blog and read her words. I would never call her names, but it's obvious that she's enjoying all the fame and attention she's getting. God knows when she will stop complaining and thanking AirBnB and admit that they made it up for her generously, even though they were never obligated to. Some argue that what they did was only out of PR pressure. IMHO, that doesn't make them bad guys, working for your company reputation isn't a bad thing to do. EJ (and others) are still saying that AirBnB should have responded more quickly, for anyone who knows even the slightest bit about businesses and entrepreneurship, it's certain that this sort of insurance policy can't be done in hours, that needs days maybe weeks and they done it well. Does anyone think they should have shared their working details with her because she's writing post after post to complain about them so they don't sound like they don't care? Some do and that is very naïve actually. If you're implying that what I said was for karma, you can check my submissions/comments history, I'm more of a lurker here, I don't comment that much and I definitely don't care about karma (less than a dozen comments in 2 years). Thank you Dysiode, you've nicely clarify my point.
- pbreit 15y ago