6 ms·

The article is not drawing an arbitrary line: > The IRS publishes a quarterly list of the names of people who have renounced their citizenship or given up thei

by jontas 5y ago

The article is not drawing an arbitrary line: > The IRS publishes a quarterly list of the names of people who have renounced their citizenship or given up their green cards, but it only includes people with global assets over $2 million It may be an arbitrary line, but if so, it's the IRS drawing it.

f38zf5vdt 5y ago
It seems like no one actually knows what the list represents. > Gibbons expected that the list would include only "a handful of the wealthiest of the wealthy" motivated solely by taxes; however, the people named in the list turned out to have a wide variety of motivations for emigrating from the U.S. and later giving up citizenship, and few were publicly known to be wealthy.[7] > ...In contrast, Andrew Mitchel, a Connecticut tax lawyer interviewed by The Wall Street Journal for its reports on Americans giving up citizenship, states that the list is required to include all former citizens. [15] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarterly_Publication_of_Individuals_Who_Have_Chosen_to_Expatriate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarterly_Publication_of_Indiv...
kogepathic 5y ago
> The IRS publishes a quarterly list of the names of people who have renounced their citizenship or given up their green cards, but it only includes people with global assets over $2 million This claim is total crap. The list includes all US citizens who renounce their citizenship, regardless of their net worth. [1] You also cannot renounce your citizenship for tax dodging [2]: > Persons who wish to renounce U.S. citizenship should be aware of the fact that renunciation of U.S. citizenship may have no effect on their U.S. tax or military service obligations (contact the Internal Revenue Service or U.S. Selective Service for more information). So plan to become rich after renouncing (and without the IRS noticing). [1] https://www.federalregister.gov/quarterly-publication-of-individuals-who-have-chosen-to-expatriate https://www.federalregister.gov/quarterly-publication-of-ind... [2] https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal/travel-legal-considerations/us-citizenship/Renunciation-US-Nationality-Abroad.html https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal/travel-lega...
- robocat 5y ago
  > You also cannot renounce your citizenship for tax dodging You just pay an exit tax, which is a percentage of your total wealth. The exit tax only applies if your total wealth is over 2 million (or less than that if you haven’t been filing properly). https://americansoverseas.org/en/knowledge-centre/us-taxes-and-liability/exit-tax-us/ https://americansoverseas.org/en/knowledge-centre/us-taxes-a...
- claytongulick 5y ago
  From [2]: E. TAX & MILITARY OBLIGATIONS /NO ESCAPE FROM PROSECUTION Persons who wish to renounce U.S. citizenship should be aware of the fact that renunciation of U.S. citizenship may have no effect on their U.S. tax or military service obligations (contact the Internal Revenue Service or U.S. Selective Service for more information). In addition, the act of renouncing U.S. citizenship does not allow persons to avoid possible prosecution for crimes which they may have committed or may commit in the future which violate United States law, or escape the repayment of financial obligations, including child support payments, previously incurred in the United States or incurred as United States citizens abroad. I read that as saying "If you owe the IRS money already, renouncing your citizenship isn't going to get you out of paying it". >So plan to become rich after renouncing (and without the IRS noticing). Do you have any other sources that corroborate this? I've certainly never heard of the IRS coming after someone for money they've earned after renouncing citizenship, except perhaps in complex cases involving international companies.
andruby 5y ago
Why does the IRS publish the list of people renouncing citizenship? And why does it filter for people with global assets over $2M? I feel like I am missing something for this to make sense.
ConSeannery 5y ago
It's not quite arbitrary, it relates to having to pay an exit tax if your global net worth meets or exceeds 2 million. You are correct in that the IRS chose this number.

by jontas 5y ago

f38zf5vdt 5y ago

It seems like no one actually knows what the list represents. > Gibbons expected that the list would include only "a handful of the wealthiest of the wealthy" motivated solely by taxes; however, the people named in the list turned out to have a wide variety of motivations for emigrating from the U.S. and later giving up citizenship, and few were publicly known to be wealthy.[7] > ...In contrast, Andrew Mitchel, a Connecticut tax lawyer interviewed by The Wall Street Journal for its reports on Americans giving up citizenship, states that the list is required to include all former citizens. [15] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarterly_Publication_of_Individuals_Who_Have_Chosen_to_Expatriate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarterly_Publication_of_Indiv...

kogepathic 5y ago

> The IRS publishes a quarterly list of the names of people who have renounced their citizenship or given up their green cards, but it only includes people with global assets over $2 million This claim is total crap. The list includes all US citizens who renounce their citizenship, regardless of their net worth. [1] You also cannot renounce your citizenship for tax dodging [2]: > Persons who wish to renounce U.S. citizenship should be aware of the fact that renunciation of U.S. citizenship may have no effect on their U.S. tax or military service obligations (contact the Internal Revenue Service or U.S. Selective Service for more information). So plan to become rich after renouncing (and without the IRS noticing). [1] https://www.federalregister.gov/quarterly-publication-of-individuals-who-have-chosen-to-expatriate https://www.federalregister.gov/quarterly-publication-of-ind... [2] https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal/travel-legal-considerations/us-citizenship/Renunciation-US-Nationality-Abroad.html https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal/travel-lega...

robocat 5y ago
> You also cannot renounce your citizenship for tax dodging You just pay an exit tax, which is a percentage of your total wealth. The exit tax only applies if your total wealth is over 2 million (or less than that if you haven’t been filing properly). https://americansoverseas.org/en/knowledge-centre/us-taxes-and-liability/exit-tax-us/ https://americansoverseas.org/en/knowledge-centre/us-taxes-a...
claytongulick 5y ago
From [2]: E. TAX & MILITARY OBLIGATIONS /NO ESCAPE FROM PROSECUTION Persons who wish to renounce U.S. citizenship should be aware of the fact that renunciation of U.S. citizenship may have no effect on their U.S. tax or military service obligations (contact the Internal Revenue Service or U.S. Selective Service for more information). In addition, the act of renouncing U.S. citizenship does not allow persons to avoid possible prosecution for crimes which they may have committed or may commit in the future which violate United States law, or escape the repayment of financial obligations, including child support payments, previously incurred in the United States or incurred as United States citizens abroad. I read that as saying "If you owe the IRS money already, renouncing your citizenship isn't going to get you out of paying it". >So plan to become rich after renouncing (and without the IRS noticing). Do you have any other sources that corroborate this? I've certainly never heard of the IRS coming after someone for money they've earned after renouncing citizenship, except perhaps in complex cases involving international companies.

andruby 5y ago

Why does the IRS publish the list of people renouncing citizenship? And why does it filter for people with global assets over $2M? I feel like I am missing something for this to make sense.

ConSeannery 5y ago

It's not quite arbitrary, it relates to having to pay an exit tax if your global net worth meets or exceeds 2 million. You are correct in that the IRS chose this number.