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Scientists Believe US Embassy and CIA Officers Hit with High-Power Microwaves

37 points by paulyg 6y ago

gabrielblack 6y ago
What about misused or defective radio equipment ? I guess that they have powerful microwave sat equipment, in there. This is a more reasonable explanation then mysterious "death ray" that, anyway, should be detectable and traceable with the right equipment, in case someone want to prove its existence. Moreover, what's the logic in creating a gratuitous diplomatic incident and possibly cause reprisals against the responsible ? IMHO , this story is the perfect click bait so nobody want to consider more logic and simple explanations.
alan-crowe 6y ago
When I worked in radar, the people in the transmitter lab had little, hand held, microwave detectors as an additional layer of safety. If a wave guide hadn't been assembled correctly and was leaking microwaves, they would be warned before they were cooked. This was 1980. Such gadgets should be very cheap today. Given the history, with the Great Seal Bug https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Thing_(listening_device) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Thing_(listening_device) I would expect plenty of monitoring; it is cheap and easy.
netsharc 6y ago
1. The article is a copy of the original: https://theconversation.com/scientists-suggest-us-embassies-were-hit-with-high-power-microwaves-heres-how-the-weapons-work-151730 https://theconversation.com/scientists-suggest-us-embassies-... . I wonder if scitechdaily is just a content farm or if they had a license to copy that content. 2. This Vanity Fair article believes it's mass hysteria: https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2019/01/the-real-story-behind-the-havana-embassy-mystery https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2019/01/the-real-story-behin...
- williamtwild 6y ago
  Isn't vanity fair a fashion magazine?
  - jfengel 6y ago
    It's a culture magazine. It started life as a fashion magazine and includes a fair bit of fashion in its content, but it has always been broader than that. It looks more like The New Yorker than Vogue or Cosmo. Or perhaps a cross between The New Yorker and GQ.
  - mc32 6y ago
    Yes but they’ve had people like Hitchens as contributors.
redsummer 6y ago
I’ve heard the Great Seal Bug described as being activated by microwaves, and wonder if all these embassies and offices were riddled with similar bugs. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Thing_(listening_device) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Thing_(listening_device)
- schappim 6y ago
  It is plausible, but the Great Seal (aka “the Thing”) only operated at 800Mhz. The microwave range is from 1 gigahertz (GHz), up to about 300 gigahertz.
jaybrendansmith 6y ago
We appear to be right back to the original explanation, an exposure to high-energy microwaves. I'd be curious to know if this is clearly an attack, or if this 'Frey effect' could happen accidentally because of nearby microwave transmission or similar?
lolc 6y ago
What I don't get about this explanation is that I'd expect high-profile embassies to be at least monitored for radio activity or even shielded against it. But maybe I'm just expecting too much vigilance here.
- beerandt 6y ago
  The couple of stories I read in detail happened at/near employee houses, not at the embassy.
  - lolc 6y ago
    Ah, that explains it. Obviously it's hard to protect against this outside.
- amscanne 6y ago
  IIUC, the microwave bursts are extremely directional, so you can’t really monitor for this effectively. Similarly, it’s bit unrealistic to cover the entire embassy in thick steel (and have no windows).
  - lolc 6y ago
    Such an attack cannot be hidden from detectors in the vincinity. There is far too much energy in the air for an antenna not to pick up on diffused and reflected emissions. On the other hand a fine, grounded mesh will protect just fine against such attacks. Even in windows. Look up IEMI shielding. Now taking these two together I think that it is possible that the embassy had both shielding and detectors. Because the attacks may have happened outside the shielding, and the detectors were inside to detect bugs.
    - amscanne 6y ago
      I accept that the detection is probably possible because of the reflection, but I’m doubting the effectiveness. (The blasts would be incredibly short, and it seems like it would be hard to distinguish between severely attenuated reflections vs noise from other sources.) Re: a mesh in the windows, given that we can’t even shield microwaves, I’m seriously doubting such a weak faraday mesh would be effective. But I don’t really know what the attenuation model would be. Perhaps my assessment is overly pessimistic, but I think your assessment is overly optimistic.

37 points by paulyg 6y ago

What about misused or defective radio equipment ? I guess that they have powerful microwave sat equipment, in there. This is a more reasonable explanation then mysterious "death ray" that, anyway, should be detectable and traceable with the right equipment, in case someone want to prove its existence. Moreover, what's the logic in creating a gratuitous diplomatic incident and possibly cause reprisals against the responsible ? IMHO , this story is the perfect click bait so nobody want to consider more logic and simple explanations.

alan-crowe 6y ago

When I worked in radar, the people in the transmitter lab had little, hand held, microwave detectors as an additional layer of safety. If a wave guide hadn't been assembled correctly and was leaking microwaves, they would be warned before they were cooked. This was 1980. Such gadgets should be very cheap today. Given the history, with the Great Seal Bug https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Thing_(listening_device) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Thing_(listening_device) I would expect plenty of monitoring; it is cheap and easy.

netsharc 6y ago

1. The article is a copy of the original: https://theconversation.com/scientists-suggest-us-embassies-were-hit-with-high-power-microwaves-heres-how-the-weapons-work-151730 https://theconversation.com/scientists-suggest-us-embassies-... . I wonder if scitechdaily is just a content farm or if they had a license to copy that content. 2. This Vanity Fair article believes it's mass hysteria: https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2019/01/the-real-story-behind-the-havana-embassy-mystery https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2019/01/the-real-story-behin...

williamtwild 6y ago
Isn't vanity fair a fashion magazine?
- jfengel 6y ago
  It's a culture magazine. It started life as a fashion magazine and includes a fair bit of fashion in its content, but it has always been broader than that. It looks more like The New Yorker than Vogue or Cosmo. Or perhaps a cross between The New Yorker and GQ.
- mc32 6y ago
  Yes but they’ve had people like Hitchens as contributors.

redsummer 6y ago

I’ve heard the Great Seal Bug described as being activated by microwaves, and wonder if all these embassies and offices were riddled with similar bugs. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Thing_(listening_device) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Thing_(listening_device)

schappim 6y ago
It is plausible, but the Great Seal (aka “the Thing”) only operated at 800Mhz. The microwave range is from 1 gigahertz (GHz), up to about 300 gigahertz.

jaybrendansmith 6y ago

We appear to be right back to the original explanation, an exposure to high-energy microwaves. I'd be curious to know if this is clearly an attack, or if this 'Frey effect' could happen accidentally because of nearby microwave transmission or similar?

lolc 6y ago

What I don't get about this explanation is that I'd expect high-profile embassies to be at least monitored for radio activity or even shielded against it. But maybe I'm just expecting too much vigilance here.

beerandt 6y ago
The couple of stories I read in detail happened at/near employee houses, not at the embassy.
- lolc 6y ago
  Ah, that explains it. Obviously it's hard to protect against this outside.
amscanne 6y ago
IIUC, the microwave bursts are extremely directional, so you can’t really monitor for this effectively. Similarly, it’s bit unrealistic to cover the entire embassy in thick steel (and have no windows).
- lolc 6y ago
  Such an attack cannot be hidden from detectors in the vincinity. There is far too much energy in the air for an antenna not to pick up on diffused and reflected emissions. On the other hand a fine, grounded mesh will protect just fine against such attacks. Even in windows. Look up IEMI shielding. Now taking these two together I think that it is possible that the embassy had both shielding and detectors. Because the attacks may have happened outside the shielding, and the detectors were inside to detect bugs.
  - amscanne 6y ago
    I accept that the detection is probably possible because of the reflection, but I’m doubting the effectiveness. (The blasts would be incredibly short, and it seems like it would be hard to distinguish between severely attenuated reflections vs noise from other sources.) Re: a mesh in the windows, given that we can’t even shield microwaves, I’m seriously doubting such a weak faraday mesh would be effective. But I don’t really know what the attenuation model would be. Perhaps my assessment is overly pessimistic, but I think your assessment is overly optimistic.