8 ms·

There's lots of citizens of UK happy today. For some it could be a waste of time. For some others, knowing UK laws are written in UK, it's a relief.

deleted 6y ago
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deergomoo 6y ago
I'm happy for them (truly—this isn't snark), but unfortunately I have far more faith in EU legislators to support my rights, my community, and my general wellbeing than a Conservative Party government.
- orange_tee 6y ago
  The European Commission are all right wing pro business people, except with even less oversight than national governments. Why would you trust Ursula von der Leyen over Boris Johnson? They are cut from the same piece of cloth.
  - funcDropShadow 6y ago
    > They are cut from the same piece of cloth. This is easily disproved by comparing the orderliness of their hair ;-) Yes, I know Boris Johnson ruffles his hair on purpose.
  - estaseuropano 6y ago
    I think you might read the wrong media. It was the UK (with little brother Denmark) that kept the EU firmly on an economically liberal course. First thing the Commission did after the Brexit notice was to publish a 'European Pillar of Social Rights' and to launch processes for common minimum social standards. Yes they do trade but look at the lineup and commissioners and half of those have social portfolios.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- blibble 6y ago
  you might want to look into who makes up the EPP (and of course: historically a large chunk of it was the Conservative Party)
- defertoreptar 6y ago
  In other words, "I don't mind that my vote carries less weight for as long as the decision-makers happen to share my political views."
  - gameshot911 6y ago
    Is there a problem with that? Of course people want to maximize a scenario where decision-makers share their political views.
    - defertoreptar 6y ago
      Yes, because you're only temporarily promised to get what you want at the expense of having voting power permanently diluted.
  - estaseuropano 6y ago
    It's probably more a matter of faith in an expertocracy with political checks and balances and ultimate political decision but apolitical implementation.
rasz 6y ago
Im guessing those are upper owner class, the ones never setting a foot in a supermarket.
- orange_tee 6y ago
  Can you elaborate on your guess? Why would the "upper owner class" benefit more from BREXIT? Not saying you are wrong. I just want to understand your thought process.
  - literallycancer 6y ago
    Same reason they are happy to do business in low regulation, low cost of labor countries? Outside the EU, it's easier to have the regulations changed.
mhh__ 6y ago
Put it this way, people will lose their jobs because of increased friction with our closest trading partner - the whole sovereignty-argument is complete drivel: If we were able to leave unilaterally then we were - by definition - never not sovereign. This may be lost on those not from the UK, but a huge amount of the cultural angle of the leave-vote was based on a "We don't want to be ruled by Germans, we beat them in WW2" - it was never about anything concrete, it's just about a vague fuck-you (in the wrong direction) in response to the Status Quo. The whole modus operandi of Brexit - for decades - is to just make up anything that sticks and blame it on the EU, and because the EU doesn't have a public face in British life there's no feedback. For example: https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jul/18/boris-johnson-claims-about-kippers-fishy-brussels-says https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jul/18/boris-johns... In Summary: We've either done something bad or pointless, all to please people who will be long dead before we get to have our cake and eat it in the future.
- danishdev 6y ago
  EU is converging towards tax harmonization and many other areas. You think EU is about free trade and movement but the EU changed direction a long time ago towards full political union. I don't like this trend so I support applying the brake on time, because the EU is driving towards a cliff.
IfOnlyYouKnew 6y ago
Well, they are somewhat delusional. I don't mind them being happy, so don't tell them the following: Most of what they think of as "law", such as criminal law or the rules of the road, always were written in the UK. The "law" that was being written in Brussels (with plenty of UK input) was to a large extend rather specific and trade-related. Yes, it was evil EU legislation that mandated orange juice to contain actual juice from real oranges. Terrible! All that will remain, though.
- estaseuropano 6y ago
  You gotta label what's in the bottle! Common quality standards for oranges! Minimum labor standards for those picking the fruit! Common labeling of origin and type of agriculture to ensure labels like 'organic' have meaning! Frictionless trade! Mechanisms to resolve contract disputes across borders! visa-free travel to orange-growing Spain! Such audacity! Such impervious intervention in our sovereign right to be f'''d over by corporations!
jasdine817 6y ago
Considering that UK businesses will now have to follow rules that the UK has no say in making, doesn't really feel like a great improvement. Especially since UK law was always legally supreme and new EU laws had to be ratified by parliament anyway.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

deergomoo 6y ago

I'm happy for them (truly—this isn't snark), but unfortunately I have far more faith in EU legislators to support my rights, my community, and my general wellbeing than a Conservative Party government.

orange_tee 6y ago
The European Commission are all right wing pro business people, except with even less oversight than national governments. Why would you trust Ursula von der Leyen over Boris Johnson? They are cut from the same piece of cloth.
- funcDropShadow 6y ago
  > They are cut from the same piece of cloth. This is easily disproved by comparing the orderliness of their hair ;-) Yes, I know Boris Johnson ruffles his hair on purpose.
- estaseuropano 6y ago
  I think you might read the wrong media. It was the UK (with little brother Denmark) that kept the EU firmly on an economically liberal course. First thing the Commission did after the Brexit notice was to publish a 'European Pillar of Social Rights' and to launch processes for common minimum social standards. Yes they do trade but look at the lineup and commissioners and half of those have social portfolios.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
blibble 6y ago
you might want to look into who makes up the EPP (and of course: historically a large chunk of it was the Conservative Party)
defertoreptar 6y ago
In other words, "I don't mind that my vote carries less weight for as long as the decision-makers happen to share my political views."
- gameshot911 6y ago
  Is there a problem with that? Of course people want to maximize a scenario where decision-makers share their political views.
  - defertoreptar 6y ago
    Yes, because you're only temporarily promised to get what you want at the expense of having voting power permanently diluted.
- estaseuropano 6y ago
  It's probably more a matter of faith in an expertocracy with political checks and balances and ultimate political decision but apolitical implementation.

rasz 6y ago

Im guessing those are upper owner class, the ones never setting a foot in a supermarket.

orange_tee 6y ago
Can you elaborate on your guess? Why would the "upper owner class" benefit more from BREXIT? Not saying you are wrong. I just want to understand your thought process.
- literallycancer 6y ago
  Same reason they are happy to do business in low regulation, low cost of labor countries? Outside the EU, it's easier to have the regulations changed.

mhh__ 6y ago

Put it this way, people will lose their jobs because of increased friction with our closest trading partner - the whole sovereignty-argument is complete drivel: If we were able to leave unilaterally then we were - by definition - never not sovereign. This may be lost on those not from the UK, but a huge amount of the cultural angle of the leave-vote was based on a "We don't want to be ruled by Germans, we beat them in WW2" - it was never about anything concrete, it's just about a vague fuck-you (in the wrong direction) in response to the Status Quo. The whole modus operandi of Brexit - for decades - is to just make up anything that sticks and blame it on the EU, and because the EU doesn't have a public face in British life there's no feedback. For example: https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jul/18/boris-johnson-claims-about-kippers-fishy-brussels-says https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jul/18/boris-johns... In Summary: We've either done something bad or pointless, all to please people who will be long dead before we get to have our cake and eat it in the future.

danishdev 6y ago
EU is converging towards tax harmonization and many other areas. You think EU is about free trade and movement but the EU changed direction a long time ago towards full political union. I don't like this trend so I support applying the brake on time, because the EU is driving towards a cliff.

IfOnlyYouKnew 6y ago

Well, they are somewhat delusional. I don't mind them being happy, so don't tell them the following: Most of what they think of as "law", such as criminal law or the rules of the road, always were written in the UK. The "law" that was being written in Brussels (with plenty of UK input) was to a large extend rather specific and trade-related. Yes, it was evil EU legislation that mandated orange juice to contain actual juice from real oranges. Terrible! All that will remain, though.

estaseuropano 6y ago
You gotta label what's in the bottle! Common quality standards for oranges! Minimum labor standards for those picking the fruit! Common labeling of origin and type of agriculture to ensure labels like 'organic' have meaning! Frictionless trade! Mechanisms to resolve contract disputes across borders! visa-free travel to orange-growing Spain! Such audacity! Such impervious intervention in our sovereign right to be f'''d over by corporations!

jasdine817 6y ago

Considering that UK businesses will now have to follow rules that the UK has no say in making, doesn't really feel like a great improvement. Especially since UK law was always legally supreme and new EU laws had to be ratified by parliament anyway.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]