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So it is not only Facebook that has complete access to the message history, but also Google. The funny thing is that I cannot find a way to access that backup

by pw6hv 6y ago

So it is not only Facebook that has complete access to the message history, but also Google. The funny thing is that I cannot find a way to access that backup myself, is anyone aware of a method to download that backup as a data dump and inspect it?

keyme 6y ago
There is no "official" way for you to download it. IIRC it is stored in your Google Drive under an API key that is dedicated to whatsapp (in some kind of per-app storage). I don't really know much about Google Drive API. However, I am fairly sure that the key is in the binary on your phone, so it shouldn't be much of a challenge to get access. I think there was something like this on Github once, that no longer works (due to trivial changes, likely). Update: https://github.com/YuriCosta/WhatsApp-GD-Extractor-Multithread https://github.com/YuriCosta/WhatsApp-GD-Extractor-Multithre... Looks recent, didn't try myself.
- arp242 6y ago
  I tried it, but I can't seem to get it to work. Possibly because I don't know the "device ID" of my Android phone since I lost it. I got an iPhone SE and turns out I can't really import the Android backup on an iPhone, and there's no way to access it either. Some backup. Damnit why is everything related to mobile so needlessly fecking difficult. I just want to read some damn plain text files that are right there but it doesn't allow me to access for no reason in particular. I hate everything about mobile so much.
  - beagle3 6y ago
    There are 3rd party products who convert WA data from iOS to Android and vice versa (and also, you might be able to get your data using a new android device or even android installed in a VM). The main problem here is that like everything FB related, you are the product, not the customer At least, I haven't found any reasonable explanation about why Google and Apple get an unencrypted copy of your chat history but you can't. (And not for lack of trying - there are always ridiculous answers on Reddit and HN about "but if you could read your messages, so can the bad guys")
ffpip 6y ago
I don't know if it is included in your Google takeout. 98% of users enable that option. The fact that whatsapp is e2ee is a complete lie. Use Signal for true e2ee, or if you don't like it, Telegram. Telegram stores everything in the cloud tho. (they haven't disclosed any private messages, and are much more trustworthy than Whatsapp). They just wanted to back up messages without giving it to Google/Apple
- jandrese 6y ago
  Seems like the messages were e2ee, and when they got to the last e they were decrypted and then immediately uploaded to a third party because yay cloud.
- JohnBerea 6y ago
  Shouldn't we prefer Matrix over Signal, since it's federated and doesn't require a phone number / phone to sign up.
  - screamingninja 6y ago
    We should, but it is much harder to get my family and friends to use Matrix.
  - ffpip 6y ago
    It's just something about Matrix. I don't know what it is. I've never opened the app after logging in. It has a good UX which is rare for open source apps. It seems to be based around a decent community. But I don't know why I don't use it.
    - anoncake 6y ago
      Network effects?
  - dbrgn 6y ago
    Federation is no panacea either, it's also a privacy tradeoff, since the communication metadata is distributed across multiple servers operated by different people (unless you only communicate with people on the same homeserver that hosts your own account).
mtgx 6y ago
Of course, why else would Google agree to store all the backup data of a competing company for free? Google would have had no interest in storing Facebook's end-to-end encrypted data unless it could read it. The moment Google and Facebook announced this partnership together I knew it was bad news and I should stay the hell away from doing such backups. But apparently many people cheered for it without realizing the implications.
Gabrielfair 6y ago
Thanks for pointing this out. I suspect this why Google agreed to store all the backup data of a competing company for free. Google would have had no interest in storing Facebook's end-to-end encrypted data for free unless it could read it and possibly resell it back to Facebook.

by pw6hv 6y ago

keyme 6y ago

There is no "official" way for you to download it. IIRC it is stored in your Google Drive under an API key that is dedicated to whatsapp (in some kind of per-app storage). I don't really know much about Google Drive API. However, I am fairly sure that the key is in the binary on your phone, so it shouldn't be much of a challenge to get access. I think there was something like this on Github once, that no longer works (due to trivial changes, likely). Update: https://github.com/YuriCosta/WhatsApp-GD-Extractor-Multithread https://github.com/YuriCosta/WhatsApp-GD-Extractor-Multithre... Looks recent, didn't try myself.

arp242 6y ago
I tried it, but I can't seem to get it to work. Possibly because I don't know the "device ID" of my Android phone since I lost it. I got an iPhone SE and turns out I can't really import the Android backup on an iPhone, and there's no way to access it either. Some backup. Damnit why is everything related to mobile so needlessly fecking difficult. I just want to read some damn plain text files that are right there but it doesn't allow me to access for no reason in particular. I hate everything about mobile so much.
- beagle3 6y ago
  There are 3rd party products who convert WA data from iOS to Android and vice versa (and also, you might be able to get your data using a new android device or even android installed in a VM). The main problem here is that like everything FB related, you are the product, not the customer At least, I haven't found any reasonable explanation about why Google and Apple get an unencrypted copy of your chat history but you can't. (And not for lack of trying - there are always ridiculous answers on Reddit and HN about "but if you could read your messages, so can the bad guys")

ffpip 6y ago

I don't know if it is included in your Google takeout. 98% of users enable that option. The fact that whatsapp is e2ee is a complete lie. Use Signal for true e2ee, or if you don't like it, Telegram. Telegram stores everything in the cloud tho. (they haven't disclosed any private messages, and are much more trustworthy than Whatsapp). They just wanted to back up messages without giving it to Google/Apple

jandrese 6y ago
Seems like the messages were e2ee, and when they got to the last e they were decrypted and then immediately uploaded to a third party because yay cloud.
JohnBerea 6y ago
Shouldn't we prefer Matrix over Signal, since it's federated and doesn't require a phone number / phone to sign up.
- screamingninja 6y ago
  We should, but it is much harder to get my family and friends to use Matrix.
- ffpip 6y ago
  It's just something about Matrix. I don't know what it is. I've never opened the app after logging in. It has a good UX which is rare for open source apps. It seems to be based around a decent community. But I don't know why I don't use it.
  - anoncake 6y ago
    Network effects?
- dbrgn 6y ago
  Federation is no panacea either, it's also a privacy tradeoff, since the communication metadata is distributed across multiple servers operated by different people (unless you only communicate with people on the same homeserver that hosts your own account).

mtgx 6y ago

Of course, why else would Google agree to store all the backup data of a competing company for free? Google would have had no interest in storing Facebook's end-to-end encrypted data unless it could read it. The moment Google and Facebook announced this partnership together I knew it was bad news and I should stay the hell away from doing such backups. But apparently many people cheered for it without realizing the implications.

Gabrielfair 6y ago

Thanks for pointing this out. I suspect this why Google agreed to store all the backup data of a competing company for free. Google would have had no interest in storing Facebook's end-to-end encrypted data for free unless it could read it and possibly resell it back to Facebook.