7 ms·

Adolphe Sax, Inventor of the Saxophone

75 points by bobf 6y ago

4x5-Guy 6y ago
I played alto and tenor sax in high school/college. What a great instrument. It still gives me chills when I hear a great sax tune.
bobf 6y ago
I played clarinet, piano, and guitar growing up, but before reading this I had no idea about the story of the relatively modern (i.e. post industrial revolution) invention of the saxophone. I never played jazz, but certainly appreciate it and this quote from the article really struck a chord with me, "Without jazz, what would music be? But without the sax, what would jazz be?"
- leguminous 6y ago
  I find it fascinating that many of these instruments did not exist in their modern forms until around the same period. Playing clarinet in school, I had never really considered that our instruments weren't necessarily the same as the ones a piece had been composed for. * The development of airtight pads for the clarinet in 1812 allowed manufacturers to add more keys, culminating in the modern Boehm system in 1839. The earlier clarinets looked like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D3NCGSvKHCQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D3NCGSvKHCQ * Between around 1800-1850, the piano gained the cast iron plate, stronger steel wires, and the double escapement action. 88 keys weren't common until the latter part of the century. Earlier pianos (fortepianos) looked like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ef95BZfYcw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ef95BZfYcw * Antonio de Torres is credited with developing the modern classical guitar starting in the 1850's. Steel string guitars were developed later, and were made commercially by Gibson and Martin starting in the 1920's. I also played the clarinet in school, took piano lessons at home, and am currently learning guitar. Great choices!
- ibiza 6y ago
  > jazz was 'pummelled' by fanatics of rhythm and noise, which even discredited the sax Sadly, I find this to be the case. I'm in the odd position of having grown up playing sax, and yet unable to enjoy it in the context of jazz.
jojobas 6y ago
Fun fact: a cone open on one end (saxophone) supports all harmonics, as does a cylinder open on both ends (flute). A cylinder open on one end (clarinet) only supports odd harmonics, which is why a clarinet sounds "rounded" and overblows into a twelfth, rather than an octave (as on former two).
- dmoy 6y ago
  Also makes it stupid difficult to do clean sounding smooth octave jumps on a clarinet.
  - bjoli 6y ago
    On one hand, it seems harder to learn, on the other: clarinet is the king of large jumps. The shit the clarinet soloists that come to my orchestra squeak out would be impossible to do that cleanly on my instrument (bassoon), even though large jumps on bassoon is considered easy. And it isn't just a Martin Fröst thing. I played recently with Christoffer Sundqvist, Emil jonasson and Harri Mäki (as well as with Fröst on several occasions) and they all did crazy big-jump-gymnastics that put every other instrument to shame. My theory is that the sparse overtones makes it _easier_ once you have the kind of control these people have.
    - jacquesm 6y ago
      Yes, I think you are 100% right. On the sax large jumps are super hard because there are so many modes of resonance to choose from and they all 'work' to some extent. If the instrument already has a strong preference for one such mode you can hit it flawlessly no matter where you come from. > 1 octave jumps on the sax were always hard for me no matter how much I practiced especially when going up I kept getting the weirdest (and sometimes pleasant but hard to reproduce) sound effects!
      - bjoli 6y ago
        Talking about sound effects and saxophone: https://youtu.be/KrFT5BcATFo https://youtu.be/KrFT5BcATFo
dehrmann 6y ago
I always assumed the Sousaphone getting that name was almost a self-indulgent joke, but it's in better company than I realized.
jacquesm 6y ago
Also, note that technically a Saxophone is a woodwind, not brass. I played the saxophone for half my life and it is still my favorite instrument sound wise, even though I can no longer play it due to a lung issue. Also, it is quite close to the human voice which makes it very nice to interact with singing voices. Fantastic invention, and modern music really would not be the same without it. Try the solos in Baker Street and Year of the Cat, then try the same songs with that same solo on a different instrument and see for yourself. What I love about this article is that it shows how much work used to go into 'designing a sound', something that we do today with synthesizers by the tweak of some buttons. That used to require a ton of craftsmanship and knowledge as well as the collaboration with others such as composers.
- throwaway_pdp09 6y ago
  A question please, "and it is still my favorite instrument sound wise". Can the sax in general be said to have one sound? I knew 2 sax players at school, their instruments were much the same in size and appearance, excepting a little ornamentation on one. One was very smooth, it was a great sound. The other was much harsher, almost braying[0]. They seemed to be played with much the same high level of skill, so why the difference? They both sounded like saxes but... [0] edit; certainly in tune but quite harsh, rough as a terrier's coat
  - sacado2 6y ago
    It's all about technique and the style you want to develop. Two singers can have very different voices too.
  - jacquesm 6y ago
    That's a good point, you can actually change the way a sax sounds quite strongly, there are even people who modify their reeds. The difference between the way the same instrument family sounds on say Pink Floyd's "Dark side of the moon" (Dick Parry) sounds versus say Brandford Marsalis, Michael Brecker, Fela Kuti, Grover Washington or (god forbid) Kenny G is huge. Of course 'saxophone' is a whole range of instruments going from Low-E giants to saxes so small you have to have pretty small fingers to not hit two valves at the same time. The mouthpiece and the reed thickness are a big factor in this as is air pressure, 'tonguing' the reed and how you shape your mouth cavity. Endless variation. But the basic harmonics are baked into the instrument, those would be very hard to change though I'm sure it is possible to manipulate which ones get amplified by the above changes to the environment. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZjZBe6o78M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZjZBe6o78M Is a nice example, it would be a pretty boring song without that raging saxophone.
tbejn 6y ago
Dinant is beautiful city, famous for Sax, but well worth the visit. Adolphe's house is a small museum, well organized.
- drlobster 6y ago
  If you do visit also get a Couque de Dinant, which I understand is the worlds hardest biscuit.
  - elvis70 6y ago
    To be eaten soaked in coffee or tea.
philg_jr 6y ago
If anyone is curious about some modern fusion of EDM and the saxophone, check out Big Gigantic (Dominic Lalli, tenor sax) and GRiZ (mostly alto sax). Seeing either of these guys live is more fun than I can describe. Also, Lalli put out a jazz album recently with a few other musicians, "A Blind Man's Blue".
incanus77 6y ago
I grew up learning the alto sax (also occasionally subbed for tenor or even bari in my small school) in the late 80s and 90s. It was impossible to not have been influenced by Kenny G, somewhat unfortunately, as a tangible path to commercial success. Still SMH... I mean, talented guy, but complete Muzak, really. I still have my 1987 Yamaha alto with Vandoren mouthpiece and pull it out every couple years. Remarkable piece of technology, really.
- singingfish 6y ago
  Pat Metheney doesn't agree with you about Kenny G's talent http://www.jazzoasis.com/methenyonkennyg.htm http://www.jazzoasis.com/methenyonkennyg.htm
  - jacquesm 6y ago
    That's still one of the best takedowns ever. As a huge Pat Metheny fan and a Kenny G hater I couldn't have agreed more with him.
  - incanus77 6y ago
    Wow, that was great. Can’t disagree. I would say that he could be talented while at the same time being crass, pandering, and derivative.

75 points by bobf 6y ago

I played alto and tenor sax in high school/college. What a great instrument. It still gives me chills when I hear a great sax tune.

bobf 6y ago

I played clarinet, piano, and guitar growing up, but before reading this I had no idea about the story of the relatively modern (i.e. post industrial revolution) invention of the saxophone. I never played jazz, but certainly appreciate it and this quote from the article really struck a chord with me, "Without jazz, what would music be? But without the sax, what would jazz be?"

leguminous 6y ago
I find it fascinating that many of these instruments did not exist in their modern forms until around the same period. Playing clarinet in school, I had never really considered that our instruments weren't necessarily the same as the ones a piece had been composed for. * The development of airtight pads for the clarinet in 1812 allowed manufacturers to add more keys, culminating in the modern Boehm system in 1839. The earlier clarinets looked like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D3NCGSvKHCQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D3NCGSvKHCQ * Between around 1800-1850, the piano gained the cast iron plate, stronger steel wires, and the double escapement action. 88 keys weren't common until the latter part of the century. Earlier pianos (fortepianos) looked like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ef95BZfYcw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ef95BZfYcw * Antonio de Torres is credited with developing the modern classical guitar starting in the 1850's. Steel string guitars were developed later, and were made commercially by Gibson and Martin starting in the 1920's. I also played the clarinet in school, took piano lessons at home, and am currently learning guitar. Great choices!
ibiza 6y ago
> jazz was 'pummelled' by fanatics of rhythm and noise, which even discredited the sax Sadly, I find this to be the case. I'm in the odd position of having grown up playing sax, and yet unable to enjoy it in the context of jazz.

jojobas 6y ago

Fun fact: a cone open on one end (saxophone) supports all harmonics, as does a cylinder open on both ends (flute). A cylinder open on one end (clarinet) only supports odd harmonics, which is why a clarinet sounds "rounded" and overblows into a twelfth, rather than an octave (as on former two).

dmoy 6y ago
Also makes it stupid difficult to do clean sounding smooth octave jumps on a clarinet.
- bjoli 6y ago
  On one hand, it seems harder to learn, on the other: clarinet is the king of large jumps. The shit the clarinet soloists that come to my orchestra squeak out would be impossible to do that cleanly on my instrument (bassoon), even though large jumps on bassoon is considered easy. And it isn't just a Martin Fröst thing. I played recently with Christoffer Sundqvist, Emil jonasson and Harri Mäki (as well as with Fröst on several occasions) and they all did crazy big-jump-gymnastics that put every other instrument to shame. My theory is that the sparse overtones makes it _easier_ once you have the kind of control these people have.
  - jacquesm 6y ago
    Yes, I think you are 100% right. On the sax large jumps are super hard because there are so many modes of resonance to choose from and they all 'work' to some extent. If the instrument already has a strong preference for one such mode you can hit it flawlessly no matter where you come from. > 1 octave jumps on the sax were always hard for me no matter how much I practiced especially when going up I kept getting the weirdest (and sometimes pleasant but hard to reproduce) sound effects!
    - bjoli 6y ago
      Talking about sound effects and saxophone: https://youtu.be/KrFT5BcATFo https://youtu.be/KrFT5BcATFo

dehrmann 6y ago

I always assumed the Sousaphone getting that name was almost a self-indulgent joke, but it's in better company than I realized.

jacquesm 6y ago

Also, note that technically a Saxophone is a woodwind, not brass. I played the saxophone for half my life and it is still my favorite instrument sound wise, even though I can no longer play it due to a lung issue. Also, it is quite close to the human voice which makes it very nice to interact with singing voices. Fantastic invention, and modern music really would not be the same without it. Try the solos in Baker Street and Year of the Cat, then try the same songs with that same solo on a different instrument and see for yourself. What I love about this article is that it shows how much work used to go into 'designing a sound', something that we do today with synthesizers by the tweak of some buttons. That used to require a ton of craftsmanship and knowledge as well as the collaboration with others such as composers.

throwaway_pdp09 6y ago
A question please, "and it is still my favorite instrument sound wise". Can the sax in general be said to have one sound? I knew 2 sax players at school, their instruments were much the same in size and appearance, excepting a little ornamentation on one. One was very smooth, it was a great sound. The other was much harsher, almost braying[0]. They seemed to be played with much the same high level of skill, so why the difference? They both sounded like saxes but... [0] edit; certainly in tune but quite harsh, rough as a terrier's coat
- sacado2 6y ago
  It's all about technique and the style you want to develop. Two singers can have very different voices too.
- jacquesm 6y ago
  That's a good point, you can actually change the way a sax sounds quite strongly, there are even people who modify their reeds. The difference between the way the same instrument family sounds on say Pink Floyd's "Dark side of the moon" (Dick Parry) sounds versus say Brandford Marsalis, Michael Brecker, Fela Kuti, Grover Washington or (god forbid) Kenny G is huge. Of course 'saxophone' is a whole range of instruments going from Low-E giants to saxes so small you have to have pretty small fingers to not hit two valves at the same time. The mouthpiece and the reed thickness are a big factor in this as is air pressure, 'tonguing' the reed and how you shape your mouth cavity. Endless variation. But the basic harmonics are baked into the instrument, those would be very hard to change though I'm sure it is possible to manipulate which ones get amplified by the above changes to the environment. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZjZBe6o78M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZjZBe6o78M Is a nice example, it would be a pretty boring song without that raging saxophone.

tbejn 6y ago

Dinant is beautiful city, famous for Sax, but well worth the visit. Adolphe's house is a small museum, well organized.

drlobster 6y ago
If you do visit also get a Couque de Dinant, which I understand is the worlds hardest biscuit.
- elvis70 6y ago
  To be eaten soaked in coffee or tea.

philg_jr 6y ago

If anyone is curious about some modern fusion of EDM and the saxophone, check out Big Gigantic (Dominic Lalli, tenor sax) and GRiZ (mostly alto sax). Seeing either of these guys live is more fun than I can describe. Also, Lalli put out a jazz album recently with a few other musicians, "A Blind Man's Blue".

incanus77 6y ago

I grew up learning the alto sax (also occasionally subbed for tenor or even bari in my small school) in the late 80s and 90s. It was impossible to not have been influenced by Kenny G, somewhat unfortunately, as a tangible path to commercial success. Still SMH... I mean, talented guy, but complete Muzak, really. I still have my 1987 Yamaha alto with Vandoren mouthpiece and pull it out every couple years. Remarkable piece of technology, really.

singingfish 6y ago
Pat Metheney doesn't agree with you about Kenny G's talent http://www.jazzoasis.com/methenyonkennyg.htm http://www.jazzoasis.com/methenyonkennyg.htm
- jacquesm 6y ago
  That's still one of the best takedowns ever. As a huge Pat Metheny fan and a Kenny G hater I couldn't have agreed more with him.
- incanus77 6y ago
  Wow, that was great. Can’t disagree. I would say that he could be talented while at the same time being crass, pandering, and derivative.