11 ms·

TODO: build a local-first livestream remote conference zoom alternative software

by webscalist 6y ago

worble 6y ago
You mean jitsi?
- WrtCdEvrydy 6y ago
  Now with beta end-to-end encryption!
ForHackernews 6y ago
Wasn't this Skype, originally? Pre-Microsoft acquisition?
- ramraj07 6y ago
  Everyone starts with p2p and realizes it doesn't work. OG skype predates fast internet and expectations of extremely smooth conferencing between arbitrary number of users. A centralised server is basically a requirement for acceptable performance.
  - pferde 6y ago
    There is a step between peer to peer and centralized, and that is federated. For most services, that should be the sweet spot.
    - fastball 6y ago
      How do you federate a video call with 10 people? Federation isn't needed because you don't need to have servers that communicate with each other, you just need some server that can host a given video call. So any open source solution works, no federation architecture is required.
      - hinkley 6y ago
        The same way people federated email forever? Local servers that contact upstream servers?
        fastball 6y ago
        My question is not "how does federation work?" It is "in what situation is federation useful for video conferencing in a way that a single open source server is not?"
        toast0 6y ago
        Depending on the network topology and number of callers, you could get some benefit from a multiple server model. Large meetings across offices could make use of a server at each office to streamline bandwidth. Not a good fit for today's reality of everyone from home or your scenario of 10 callers. Could still be useful for EU vs US callers to connect locally and only one stream across the atlantic. Multiparty e2e calling is already challenging, and adding multi-hop routing might make it more so, though.
        hinkley 6y ago
        Restatement of the other responder: You put a repeater on (at least) one side of every bottleneck to remove redundant traffic.
      - pferde 6y ago
        The "how" would depend on how you implement it. The servers could determine at the beginning which one gets to host the call and tell all participating clients to connect there, or there could be some client-server-server-client model akin to e.g. IRC, where you would save some server bandwidth in exchange for worse latency (more hops). I'm just spitballing here, mind you.
  - sukilot 6y ago
    What does the server do that the callers can't? Compress video?
    - paulryanrogers 6y ago
      It condenses the video streams so each participant doesn't need streams directly from every other participant. Also helps with NAT punching.
- riffic 6y ago
  skype was never open.
jeremija 6y ago
I've been developing Peer Calls since 2016. It's an open source WebRTC group conferencing solution, doesn't require a user account, has a full-mesh P2P and SFU mode (streaming through central server). Works on Android, iOS, Firefox, Chrome, Safari, latest Edge and there is no app - only a link that you need to share: https://peercalls.com/ https://peercalls.com/
Pxtl 6y ago
For the audio side, Mumble is okay. Doesn't do feedback cancellation as well as Zoom, and it uses keys to auth which are really confusing for the user (and the UI isn't great at letting you switch which you're using). But I got a mumble server up and running in no time flat, so it works that way, and the audio quality is amazing - far better than Zoom - as long as everybody's wearing properly-configured headsets.

TODO: build a local-first livestream remote conference zoom alternative software

worble 6y ago

You mean jitsi?

WrtCdEvrydy 6y ago
Now with beta end-to-end encryption!

ForHackernews 6y ago

Wasn't this Skype, originally? Pre-Microsoft acquisition?

ramraj07 6y ago
Everyone starts with p2p and realizes it doesn't work. OG skype predates fast internet and expectations of extremely smooth conferencing between arbitrary number of users. A centralised server is basically a requirement for acceptable performance.
- pferde 6y ago
  There is a step between peer to peer and centralized, and that is federated. For most services, that should be the sweet spot.
  - fastball 6y ago
    How do you federate a video call with 10 people? Federation isn't needed because you don't need to have servers that communicate with each other, you just need some server that can host a given video call. So any open source solution works, no federation architecture is required.
    - hinkley 6y ago
      The same way people federated email forever? Local servers that contact upstream servers?
      - fastball 6y ago
        My question is not "how does federation work?" It is "in what situation is federation useful for video conferencing in a way that a single open source server is not?"
        toast0 6y ago
        Depending on the network topology and number of callers, you could get some benefit from a multiple server model. Large meetings across offices could make use of a server at each office to streamline bandwidth. Not a good fit for today's reality of everyone from home or your scenario of 10 callers. Could still be useful for EU vs US callers to connect locally and only one stream across the atlantic. Multiparty e2e calling is already challenging, and adding multi-hop routing might make it more so, though.
        hinkley 6y ago
        Restatement of the other responder: You put a repeater on (at least) one side of every bottleneck to remove redundant traffic.
    - pferde 6y ago
      The "how" would depend on how you implement it. The servers could determine at the beginning which one gets to host the call and tell all participating clients to connect there, or there could be some client-server-server-client model akin to e.g. IRC, where you would save some server bandwidth in exchange for worse latency (more hops). I'm just spitballing here, mind you.
- sukilot 6y ago
  What does the server do that the callers can't? Compress video?
  - paulryanrogers 6y ago
    It condenses the video streams so each participant doesn't need streams directly from every other participant. Also helps with NAT punching.
riffic 6y ago
skype was never open.

jeremija 6y ago

I've been developing Peer Calls since 2016. It's an open source WebRTC group conferencing solution, doesn't require a user account, has a full-mesh P2P and SFU mode (streaming through central server). Works on Android, iOS, Firefox, Chrome, Safari, latest Edge and there is no app - only a link that you need to share: https://peercalls.com/ https://peercalls.com/

Pxtl 6y ago

For the audio side, Mumble is okay. Doesn't do feedback cancellation as well as Zoom, and it uses keys to auth which are really confusing for the user (and the UI isn't great at letting you switch which you're using). But I got a mumble server up and running in no time flat, so it works that way, and the audio quality is amazing - far better than Zoom - as long as everybody's wearing properly-configured headsets.