6 ms·

Between Workaholism and Procrastination (2015)

56 points by jamalx31 6y ago

duncanawoods 6y ago
What is the thesis of the book? Instead of opposites, I would consider both Workaholism and Procrastination as forms of experiential avoidance coping strategies. Instead of a golden-mean between the two, the ideal point is off the line, where you have the psychological flexibility to live a valued life despite difficult feelings and avoid both traps i.e. Acceptance and Commitment theory. n.b. I see you are using ideas from Tim Urban, I would suggest referencing him properly rather than just copying.
- cdrake 6y ago
  was about to say the same thing about the refs... seems to forget to reference other concepts and ideas in his other blog posts too. "Instant Gratification Monkey...Panic Monster" -https://waitbutwhy.com/2013/10/why-procrastinators-procrastinate.html https://waitbutwhy.com/2013/10/why-procrastinators-procrasti...
  - jamalx31 6y ago
    could you please tell what other refs you see in other posts? I will update them
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- jamalx31 6y ago
  > I see you are using ideas from Tim Urban, I would suggest referencing him properly rather than just copying. Thanks for pointing this out, a human error. I've updated the post to point to the original idea from Tim post
battery423 6y ago
huh? A weird blog post becomes an ad for a book? Whatever this example should demonstrate, it doesn't make me curious about the book.
- jamalx31 6y ago
  it wasn't meat as an ad, just for context. In some places I say "this chapter.." which doesn't make since in a blog post without context. also appreciate your honest feedback. Any personal thoughts on how to deal with procrastination without turning to a workaholic
  - battery423 6y ago
    It simplifies procrastination and throws in happiness with procrastination and workaholic. You also assume your worldview. When i hear your digital nomade lifestyle i'm not envy it and i'm not connecting to your worldview. Procrastination doesn't mean 'not working'. Workaholic doesn't mean 'unhappy'.
    - mxmzb 6y ago
      Workoholic doesn't mean 'unhappy', yes, but how does procrastination not mean 'not working'? In this context, it litterally means 'postponing the work'.
tobr 6y ago
Small warning: There’s a slightly shocking gif in this article, which possibly depicts animal cruelty. (Hard to say exactly what’s going on in it).
- talideon 6y ago
  Unlikely: there's no visible motor on the wheel (it appears to just be a clip holding it in place, so all that speed is the hamster's doing. It's no more animal cruelty than tripping and faceplanting while running would be the ground assaulting you.
zozin 6y ago
I get the sense that digital nomadism is akin to a multi-level marketing scam; the only people making actual money are the ones recruiting others to the "lifestyle" by advertising their blogs, books and guides (see OP).
- jamalx31 6y ago
  a digital nomad myself I have to disagree. digital nomadism is just a life style like any other, and it's not for everyone. I know many ppl who tried it and went back to 9-5 jobs and thats totally fine
  - mszcz 6y ago
    Where can I buy your book on how to do it successfully? :))
    - jamalx31 6y ago
      hehe, I didn't write one (yet :p). but if you wanna chat about it, i'm down. ping me on twitter
      - mszcz 6y ago
        Oh, it was just a joke ;) I've been down this road way too many times - procrastinating instead of working by "researching" or "learning" how to do things differently, more efficiently, learing new tools, paradigms etc. that will improve my productivity and whatnot. What I've learned is it's way better to just do stuff and improve things as you go (be that the optimal way to be a digital nomad or whatever ;)
- bryanrasmussen 6y ago
  I guess I'd disagree, since multi-level marketing scams are marketed as ways to make money, and as a general rule that is not what digital nomadism is marketed as.
- tristor 6y ago
pizza234 6y ago
This seems to me the idea(s) of a young person who's working (no pun intended) on the small picture, but missing the big one. In short, somebody who doesn't know yet what to do in life, however, not what to do in the planning or business sense (which is what described in the post), but more precisely, what they _want_ to do. To me, rather the conceptualization(s) proposed, the words of John Carmack are immensely more powerful: when asked about what's the difference that being rich made to him, he replied "not much, I wake up in the morning, I go to work, and I do my best"¹. ¹=I can't find the reference. I don't think it comes from Masters of Doom.
- MathCodeLove 6y ago
  > when asked about what's the difference being rich has made to him I think that this quote, while well meaning, misses what being lower class is. It's about the constance worry and anxiety over being able to provide. It's being terrified of every accident or potential set back. It's about constantly sacrificing wants for needs. Being even upper middle class alleviates many of these, and being rich alleviates almost all of them entirely.
- Chris2048 6y ago
  TBH though, Carmack gets to choose what work he does in virtue of being wealthy.
  - pizza234 6y ago
    I don't really get this, but Carmack's wealth has been, and is, completely disconnected from his software career. I can take that he may not have founded his aerospace company without plenty of money, but that's not what he's mostly known for, or even better, what he represents (one of the greatest software engineers).
fizixer 6y ago
I have this idea where I can work my neck off for 4-6 months (including weekends; essentially eat, sleep, restroom, and work 24x7). And then I need the rest of the year off. I'm not sure how to find this kind of work. Some have advised that I should seek contract work. But contract work is hell, no thanks.
- stronglikedan 6y ago
  Aside from contract work, I think you've pretty much limited your choices to consultant or commercial fisherman.
  - ghaff 6y ago
    Even consultant is tough. You have a business that you need to run and typically can't just disappear for 6 months at a time and largely ignore everything going on in the industry. It's actually almost certainly easier to consult part-time (whether you intend it to be part-time or not!) than it is to go 120% for 6 months and then rapidly ratchet it to zero for another 6. I think the only person I know who has done something like this was a lawyer who worked as a contract lawyer for some big finance company (I think) for about half the year. Which doesn't sound like a bad gig. But it's hard for most white collar jobs.
- taneq 6y ago
  Ski instructor? Mine site commissioning engineer? Game developer (except you get the rest of the year off because you got fired when the game shipped.)
pantalaimon 6y ago
> I wake up around 6 am, go to the gym with my buddy, come back to my room to take a shower, eat a bowl of salad and then leave for work. I get to work around 9 am, leave around 5 to meet friends, hang out, or do whatever activity I was planning for that evening. Where do people get that energy?
- digitalsushi 6y ago
  I remember that kind of energy was normal when I was content
  - alltakendamned 6y ago
    and 23
- jamalx31 6y ago
  This will sound wired. But the days I wake up early I usually have more energy (ofc I need to get enough sleep).
intrepidhero 6y ago
I think that if you can find a way to intrinsically value yourself and your life you may find it easier to get balance with your work. The graph of Procrastination vs. Workaholism has many more dimensions.
tingletech 6y ago
(2015) in the title is an error. 2015 in just the first heading in a chronological story, the last heading being "March 2020"

56 points by jamalx31 6y ago

What is the thesis of the book? Instead of opposites, I would consider both Workaholism and Procrastination as forms of experiential avoidance coping strategies. Instead of a golden-mean between the two, the ideal point is off the line, where you have the psychological flexibility to live a valued life despite difficult feelings and avoid both traps i.e. Acceptance and Commitment theory. n.b. I see you are using ideas from Tim Urban, I would suggest referencing him properly rather than just copying.

cdrake 6y ago
was about to say the same thing about the refs... seems to forget to reference other concepts and ideas in his other blog posts too. "Instant Gratification Monkey...Panic Monster" -https://waitbutwhy.com/2013/10/why-procrastinators-procrastinate.html https://waitbutwhy.com/2013/10/why-procrastinators-procrasti...
- jamalx31 6y ago
  could you please tell what other refs you see in other posts? I will update them
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
jamalx31 6y ago
> I see you are using ideas from Tim Urban, I would suggest referencing him properly rather than just copying. Thanks for pointing this out, a human error. I've updated the post to point to the original idea from Tim post

battery423 6y ago

huh? A weird blog post becomes an ad for a book? Whatever this example should demonstrate, it doesn't make me curious about the book.

jamalx31 6y ago
it wasn't meat as an ad, just for context. In some places I say "this chapter.." which doesn't make since in a blog post without context. also appreciate your honest feedback. Any personal thoughts on how to deal with procrastination without turning to a workaholic
- battery423 6y ago
  It simplifies procrastination and throws in happiness with procrastination and workaholic. You also assume your worldview. When i hear your digital nomade lifestyle i'm not envy it and i'm not connecting to your worldview. Procrastination doesn't mean 'not working'. Workaholic doesn't mean 'unhappy'.
  - mxmzb 6y ago
    Workoholic doesn't mean 'unhappy', yes, but how does procrastination not mean 'not working'? In this context, it litterally means 'postponing the work'.

tobr 6y ago

Small warning: There’s a slightly shocking gif in this article, which possibly depicts animal cruelty. (Hard to say exactly what’s going on in it).

talideon 6y ago
Unlikely: there's no visible motor on the wheel (it appears to just be a clip holding it in place, so all that speed is the hamster's doing. It's no more animal cruelty than tripping and faceplanting while running would be the ground assaulting you.

zozin 6y ago

I get the sense that digital nomadism is akin to a multi-level marketing scam; the only people making actual money are the ones recruiting others to the "lifestyle" by advertising their blogs, books and guides (see OP).

jamalx31 6y ago
a digital nomad myself I have to disagree. digital nomadism is just a life style like any other, and it's not for everyone. I know many ppl who tried it and went back to 9-5 jobs and thats totally fine
- mszcz 6y ago
  Where can I buy your book on how to do it successfully? :))
  - jamalx31 6y ago
    hehe, I didn't write one (yet :p). but if you wanna chat about it, i'm down. ping me on twitter
    - mszcz 6y ago
      Oh, it was just a joke ;) I've been down this road way too many times - procrastinating instead of working by "researching" or "learning" how to do things differently, more efficiently, learing new tools, paradigms etc. that will improve my productivity and whatnot. What I've learned is it's way better to just do stuff and improve things as you go (be that the optimal way to be a digital nomad or whatever ;)
bryanrasmussen 6y ago
I guess I'd disagree, since multi-level marketing scams are marketed as ways to make money, and as a general rule that is not what digital nomadism is marketed as.
tristor 6y ago

pizza234 6y ago

This seems to me the idea(s) of a young person who's working (no pun intended) on the small picture, but missing the big one. In short, somebody who doesn't know yet what to do in life, however, not what to do in the planning or business sense (which is what described in the post), but more precisely, what they _want_ to do. To me, rather the conceptualization(s) proposed, the words of John Carmack are immensely more powerful: when asked about what's the difference that being rich made to him, he replied "not much, I wake up in the morning, I go to work, and I do my best"¹. ¹=I can't find the reference. I don't think it comes from Masters of Doom.

MathCodeLove 6y ago
> when asked about what's the difference being rich has made to him I think that this quote, while well meaning, misses what being lower class is. It's about the constance worry and anxiety over being able to provide. It's being terrified of every accident or potential set back. It's about constantly sacrificing wants for needs. Being even upper middle class alleviates many of these, and being rich alleviates almost all of them entirely.
Chris2048 6y ago
TBH though, Carmack gets to choose what work he does in virtue of being wealthy.
- pizza234 6y ago
  I don't really get this, but Carmack's wealth has been, and is, completely disconnected from his software career. I can take that he may not have founded his aerospace company without plenty of money, but that's not what he's mostly known for, or even better, what he represents (one of the greatest software engineers).

fizixer 6y ago

I have this idea where I can work my neck off for 4-6 months (including weekends; essentially eat, sleep, restroom, and work 24x7). And then I need the rest of the year off. I'm not sure how to find this kind of work. Some have advised that I should seek contract work. But contract work is hell, no thanks.

stronglikedan 6y ago
Aside from contract work, I think you've pretty much limited your choices to consultant or commercial fisherman.
- ghaff 6y ago
  Even consultant is tough. You have a business that you need to run and typically can't just disappear for 6 months at a time and largely ignore everything going on in the industry. It's actually almost certainly easier to consult part-time (whether you intend it to be part-time or not!) than it is to go 120% for 6 months and then rapidly ratchet it to zero for another 6. I think the only person I know who has done something like this was a lawyer who worked as a contract lawyer for some big finance company (I think) for about half the year. Which doesn't sound like a bad gig. But it's hard for most white collar jobs.
taneq 6y ago
Ski instructor? Mine site commissioning engineer? Game developer (except you get the rest of the year off because you got fired when the game shipped.)

pantalaimon 6y ago

> I wake up around 6 am, go to the gym with my buddy, come back to my room to take a shower, eat a bowl of salad and then leave for work. I get to work around 9 am, leave around 5 to meet friends, hang out, or do whatever activity I was planning for that evening. Where do people get that energy?

digitalsushi 6y ago
I remember that kind of energy was normal when I was content
- alltakendamned 6y ago
  and 23
jamalx31 6y ago
This will sound wired. But the days I wake up early I usually have more energy (ofc I need to get enough sleep).

intrepidhero 6y ago

I think that if you can find a way to intrinsically value yourself and your life you may find it easier to get balance with your work. The graph of Procrastination vs. Workaholism has many more dimensions.

tingletech 6y ago

(2015) in the title is an error. 2015 in just the first heading in a chronological story, the last heading being "March 2020"