6 ms·

He lost 45 lbs, that’s what probably removed his sleeps apnea. Not because of some other magical ability of intermittent fasting. One of my friends also lost a

He lost 45 lbs, that’s what probably removed his sleeps apnea. Not because of some other magical ability of intermittent fasting. One of my friends also lost a lot of weight and his apnea went away, he went off of his CPAP machine.

pwdisswordfish2 6y ago
Apnea can lead to binge eating, so it may be the apenea was in part responsible for gaining the 45 lbs!
- johnchristopher 6y ago
  > Apnea can lead to binge eating How so ?
  - pbhjpbhj 6y ago
    Not OP. I've an issue with sleep related binge-eating: fullness induces sleepiness, so when I'm awake at night and want to be asleep I'll eat - basically an extra meal. Alcohol too. For me the root issue is other mental health problems. Sleep problems can readily lead to weight gain. I can see how apnoea that exhibits as waking up a lot might lead someone attempting to fall into heavier sleep by overeating. IF, paired with lots of exercise, was working for me before the current crisis.
    - johnchristopher 6y ago
      But sleep apnea doesn't wake you up enough to get out of bed and start eating like pulling all-nighters or insomnia do and going to sleep with a full belly won't prevent flesh/muscle collapsing that causes sleep apnea although I can see how the body burning energy to digest + endorphin from a good meal might help falling asleep faster. > IF, paired with lots of exercise, was working for me before the current crisis. You mean the pandemic/lockdown ?
      - pbhjpbhj 6y ago
        I've heard people referring to complex sleep issues as apnoea - I was just suggesting there can be complex causative links. Hopefully the OP can respond an answer the actual question. Yes, I meant lockdown.
        johnchristopher 6y ago
        > I've heard people referring to complex sleep issues as apnoea Ah, it might be a translation issue on my part then. I am inclined to believe there are some complex causative links, hope research will bring new hypotheses and answers about that.
  - neffy 6y ago
    It's strongly suspected that there's a nasty feedback loop between disrupted sleep (caused by apnea) and weight gain due to interference with appetite regulation.
  - pwdisswordfish2 6y ago
    To be fair, I was assuming the person was still suffering from sleep deprivation even while on the CPAP treatment. (Bias disclosure: I have personal experience in this area.) It is possible this person was sleeping well and not suffering from sleep deprivation. At this stage, I am not sure anyone, let alone myself, can elucidate the precise mechanism of how OSA/sleep deprivation leads to abnormal eating patterns, however I think even just a cursory review of the literature shows general agreement that there is a link between the two. Here is an abstract from a review published in 2017: Obesity and obstructive sleep apnea (OSA) have a reciprocal relationship. Sleep disruptions characteristic of OSA may promote behavioral, metabolic, and/or hormonal changes favoring weight gain and/or difficulty losing weight. The regulation of energy balance (EB), i.e., the relationship between energy intake (EI) and energy expenditure (EE), is complex and multi-factorial, involving food intake, hormonal regulation of hunger/satiety/appetite, and EE via metabolism and physical activity (PA). The current systematic review describes the literature on how OSA affects EB-related parameters. OSA is associated with a hormonal profile characterized by abnormally high leptin and ghrelin levels, which may encourage excess EI. Data on actual measures of food intake are lacking, and not sufficient to make conclusions. Resting metabolic rate appears elevated in OSA vs. Controls: Findings on PA are inconsistent, but may indicate a negative relationship with OSA severity that is modulated by daytime sleepiness and body weight. A speculative explanation for the positive EB in OSA is that the increased EE via metabolism induces an overcompensation in the drive for hunger/food intake, which is larger in magnitude than the rise in EI required to re-establish EB. Understanding how OSA affects EB-related parameters can help improve weight loss efforts in these patients. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.smrv.2016.07.001 https://doi.org/10.1016/j.smrv.2016.07.001
    - johnchristopher 6y ago
      > To be fair, I was assuming the person was still suffering from sleep deprivation even while on the CPAP treatment. (Bias disclosure: I have personal experience in this area.) Yeah, I can say from first hand experience that CPAP doesn't always solve every sleep problems :/. Thanks for the link, it's shedding some light on things that I suspected.
downerending 6y ago
You're probably correct, in that losing a lot of weight greatly improved his health. That said, losing weight is freaking difficult, and if intermittent fasting is a path towards that, it'd be very useful. I've done a lot of fasting. The results seem pretty good. Pulling it off is non-trivial. At this point, we need "magical", because nothing else has really seemed to work in general for losing weight. (And no, didn't read the article, because paywall.)
- t-writescode 6y ago
  If calorie counting and exercise aren’t working, it’s time to go to the doctor. You may have a hormonal imbalance or something. It affects more people then realize it.
  - jmchuster 6y ago
    Unfortunately, humans are terrible at these two basics. e.g. "it's just a cookie i'm having for a snack, that doesn't count, does it?" or "i walk up three flights of stairs to work every day, that's the same as 30 minutes of exercise a day, right?"
- tarsinge 6y ago
  I agree that IF is for me the easiest way to lose weight, people should really give it a try. But in regards to the need of something magical because it’s difficult, as someone who has lost a lot of weight and stopped smoking, the latter was orders of magnitude harder. Wanting to smoke a cig was like being tempted by a cookie AFTER a fast. Also controlling my weight is child’s play compared to building muscle with a good muscle/fat ratio.
- tom_mellior 6y ago
  > work in general That's far from sure at this point. Yes, HN is a hotbed of intermittent fasting propaganda [1], which may make it seem like there is general agreement. But you'll find other communities pushing other diets as the one true diet, so... more research is needed. [1] Note, for example, that the submitter subtly but crucially changed the title, which in the original says "works for many" (emphasis mine).
ryan-allen 6y ago
I am overweight and have OSA as a result (and treated with CPAP), I never had OSA when I was at a healthy weight.

pwdisswordfish2 6y ago

Apnea can lead to binge eating, so it may be the apenea was in part responsible for gaining the 45 lbs!

johnchristopher 6y ago
> Apnea can lead to binge eating How so ?
- pbhjpbhj 6y ago
  Not OP. I've an issue with sleep related binge-eating: fullness induces sleepiness, so when I'm awake at night and want to be asleep I'll eat - basically an extra meal. Alcohol too. For me the root issue is other mental health problems. Sleep problems can readily lead to weight gain. I can see how apnoea that exhibits as waking up a lot might lead someone attempting to fall into heavier sleep by overeating. IF, paired with lots of exercise, was working for me before the current crisis.
  - johnchristopher 6y ago
    But sleep apnea doesn't wake you up enough to get out of bed and start eating like pulling all-nighters or insomnia do and going to sleep with a full belly won't prevent flesh/muscle collapsing that causes sleep apnea although I can see how the body burning energy to digest + endorphin from a good meal might help falling asleep faster. > IF, paired with lots of exercise, was working for me before the current crisis. You mean the pandemic/lockdown ?
    - pbhjpbhj 6y ago
      I've heard people referring to complex sleep issues as apnoea - I was just suggesting there can be complex causative links. Hopefully the OP can respond an answer the actual question. Yes, I meant lockdown.
      - johnchristopher 6y ago
        > I've heard people referring to complex sleep issues as apnoea Ah, it might be a translation issue on my part then. I am inclined to believe there are some complex causative links, hope research will bring new hypotheses and answers about that.
- neffy 6y ago
  It's strongly suspected that there's a nasty feedback loop between disrupted sleep (caused by apnea) and weight gain due to interference with appetite regulation.
- pwdisswordfish2 6y ago
  To be fair, I was assuming the person was still suffering from sleep deprivation even while on the CPAP treatment. (Bias disclosure: I have personal experience in this area.) It is possible this person was sleeping well and not suffering from sleep deprivation. At this stage, I am not sure anyone, let alone myself, can elucidate the precise mechanism of how OSA/sleep deprivation leads to abnormal eating patterns, however I think even just a cursory review of the literature shows general agreement that there is a link between the two. Here is an abstract from a review published in 2017: Obesity and obstructive sleep apnea (OSA) have a reciprocal relationship. Sleep disruptions characteristic of OSA may promote behavioral, metabolic, and/or hormonal changes favoring weight gain and/or difficulty losing weight. The regulation of energy balance (EB), i.e., the relationship between energy intake (EI) and energy expenditure (EE), is complex and multi-factorial, involving food intake, hormonal regulation of hunger/satiety/appetite, and EE via metabolism and physical activity (PA). The current systematic review describes the literature on how OSA affects EB-related parameters. OSA is associated with a hormonal profile characterized by abnormally high leptin and ghrelin levels, which may encourage excess EI. Data on actual measures of food intake are lacking, and not sufficient to make conclusions. Resting metabolic rate appears elevated in OSA vs. Controls: Findings on PA are inconsistent, but may indicate a negative relationship with OSA severity that is modulated by daytime sleepiness and body weight. A speculative explanation for the positive EB in OSA is that the increased EE via metabolism induces an overcompensation in the drive for hunger/food intake, which is larger in magnitude than the rise in EI required to re-establish EB. Understanding how OSA affects EB-related parameters can help improve weight loss efforts in these patients. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.smrv.2016.07.001 https://doi.org/10.1016/j.smrv.2016.07.001
  - johnchristopher 6y ago
    > To be fair, I was assuming the person was still suffering from sleep deprivation even while on the CPAP treatment. (Bias disclosure: I have personal experience in this area.) Yeah, I can say from first hand experience that CPAP doesn't always solve every sleep problems :/. Thanks for the link, it's shedding some light on things that I suspected.

downerending 6y ago

You're probably correct, in that losing a lot of weight greatly improved his health. That said, losing weight is freaking difficult, and if intermittent fasting is a path towards that, it'd be very useful. I've done a lot of fasting. The results seem pretty good. Pulling it off is non-trivial. At this point, we need "magical", because nothing else has really seemed to work in general for losing weight. (And no, didn't read the article, because paywall.)

t-writescode 6y ago
If calorie counting and exercise aren’t working, it’s time to go to the doctor. You may have a hormonal imbalance or something. It affects more people then realize it.
- jmchuster 6y ago
  Unfortunately, humans are terrible at these two basics. e.g. "it's just a cookie i'm having for a snack, that doesn't count, does it?" or "i walk up three flights of stairs to work every day, that's the same as 30 minutes of exercise a day, right?"
tarsinge 6y ago
I agree that IF is for me the easiest way to lose weight, people should really give it a try. But in regards to the need of something magical because it’s difficult, as someone who has lost a lot of weight and stopped smoking, the latter was orders of magnitude harder. Wanting to smoke a cig was like being tempted by a cookie AFTER a fast. Also controlling my weight is child’s play compared to building muscle with a good muscle/fat ratio.
tom_mellior 6y ago
> work in general That's far from sure at this point. Yes, HN is a hotbed of intermittent fasting propaganda [1], which may make it seem like there is general agreement. But you'll find other communities pushing other diets as the one true diet, so... more research is needed. [1] Note, for example, that the submitter subtly but crucially changed the title, which in the original says "works for many" (emphasis mine).

ryan-allen 6y ago

I am overweight and have OSA as a result (and treated with CPAP), I never had OSA when I was at a healthy weight.