4 ms·

The Delight of Development

55 points by zan 6y ago

troughway 6y ago
I wish people would write blog posts about doing things they “love” without trying to underhandedly sell something. If you liked this comment, hit that subscribe button and leave a comment and I’ll see you next time!
- blauditore 6y ago
  After reading a few sentences, it felt the same for me. I always feel alienated by blog posts that try to hide the fact they're an ad by pulling off a "hey, we're just like you" stunt.
  - runawaybottle 6y ago
    Reminds me of the South Park bit: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z696bTiP8Ro https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z696bTiP8Ro
- otaviokz 6y ago
  As soon as read "hacking" being used as a synonym for coding/development, I started to get angry. I still read it just in case I was wrong, just to end up being right, and angry.
  - xenonite 6y ago
    Depends on whom you ask. For many if not most computer people, "hacking" is synonymous to coding, and indeed something very positive. In the public however, "hacking" is often more used synonymous to "cracking", which I find very unsettling and sad. At least there is nowadays some awareness that there is a different meaning to it. I guess that the word "hackathon" helped to change the public perception.
  - dionidium 6y ago
    For a certain cohort that likely has a lot of exposure here on HN, "hacker" used to mean "good programmer" sounds perfectly normal.
  - proverbialbunny 6y ago
    Hacking traditionally refers to prototyping like, "quickly hacking something up" and was pretty common in the Perl/dot com bubble days where everything was some clever hack, just to get it out the door as quickly as possible.
wiz21c 6y ago
I love software development as a creative task. It means, I love it when I do create, that is, when I make something that is the fruit of my imagination. Development is a nightmare for me when I have to develop someone else's (i.e. my company) idea. At that point, it's not creation anymore, it's execution.
- proverbialbunny 6y ago
  Me too. This is why I went into data science years ago. It's more difficult, but when correlated with difficulty you can get a good feel how creative the project is going to be.
  - vharuck 6y ago
    Don't you have to make analyses and reports "production quality?" I found that fun at first, but now it's annoying when 25% of my code is formatting and capitalizing.
    - proverbialbunny 6y ago
      No, I'm not a machine learning software engineer, so no productionization on my end. I do find paths forward for the companies I've worked at but a report usually consists of a 1-to-1 with a c-suite pitching the project. If I've written a model, the notebook speaks for itself and naturally looks glorious with plots and what not. I have been known to create power point slides or do larger presentations. It is part of the job but I've never associated the terminology "production quality" with a presentation. >25% of my code is formatting and capitalizing. I haven't personally used it because by default I tend to write reasonably clean code but https://github.com/ryantam626/jupyterlab_code_formatter https://github.com/ryantam626/jupyterlab_code_formatter or similar might help.
gazzini 6y ago
I think these types of reflections are generally important — “the unexamined life is not worth living” and all that. Thanks for sharing! I was surprised by this sentence: > My measure for a well tested system? One that lets you deploy at 5pm on a Friday before confidently heading to the pub for a few pints with the team that just shipped. It feels... optimistic.
kharak 6y ago
I really like to hear more from people who don't care about coding or software development in general. I'd assume the majority of developers is not doing coding at home, as long as they don't have to learn a new skill for their next job. They neither hate nor love coding, they tolerate it as a means to an end. I also assume that those developers rise as much through the ranks as the love coding kind. At least that's my observation so far. Or to be more precise, I belive they more of the not loving kind rise through the ranks. But it's rare hearing from them. They don't care too much about what they do at work, at least not as a trade, hence no blogging. And we all feel that it's unwise to be open about not being pashioned about your work.
- rrdharan 6y ago
  I agree it does seem like there's a silent majority that is underrepresented sort of by definition :). I also share your sentiment in that I am kind of tired of reading evangelism from Developer Advocates/DevRel. There's inherently no skin in the game - they don't suffer if the snake oil they are promoting collapses in a mess of security violations, compliance concerns or productivity implosions two years later. Fundamentally it seems like you can't know if something really works unless you really try to build something with it and that takes 18+ months during which time you can't be out there shilling at conferences all day.
- karatestomp 6y ago
  > I'd assume the majority of developers is not doing coding at home, as long as they don't have to learn a new skill for their next job. They neither hate nor love coding, they tolerate it as a means to an end. Coding's fine. Sometimes fun. Our tools mostly suck though. I'm done fucking around with broken technology in my spare time, since I get more than enough of that at work (at this point I'd prefer zero time doing that), which means I'm mostly done with tech shit. These days I'd even get rid of home Internet if no-one in the house needed it for work or (increasingly) homework. Can buy more media than I need for the cost of broadband + media services, libraries exist, and books are better besides (one of the most truly valuable parts of the Internet is Library Genesis, which is illegal anyway, and is all about... books and journals). I was all about this stuff as a teenager. Now I wish I could find something that pays even close to as well that never, ever involved looking at a glowing screen. I'd absolutely love to go weeks without touching a computer.
truth_be_told 6y ago
Ah yes; a fluff piece with nothing in it. Article is named "Delight of Development" but of course the author is "not a developer anymore". >My focus now is less on building software myself, and more about enabling others build better software. Translation: I don't produce anything but lord it over people who do. What the hell is "Developer Relations"? Has the industry gone mad? Most of us got into programming because we enjoyed it; until the "Industry" with its useless "managemeent" layers destroyed our motivation/enjoyment of it and turned us into unhappy drones.

55 points by zan 6y ago

I wish people would write blog posts about doing things they “love” without trying to underhandedly sell something. If you liked this comment, hit that subscribe button and leave a comment and I’ll see you next time!

blauditore 6y ago
After reading a few sentences, it felt the same for me. I always feel alienated by blog posts that try to hide the fact they're an ad by pulling off a "hey, we're just like you" stunt.
- runawaybottle 6y ago
  Reminds me of the South Park bit: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z696bTiP8Ro https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z696bTiP8Ro
otaviokz 6y ago
As soon as read "hacking" being used as a synonym for coding/development, I started to get angry. I still read it just in case I was wrong, just to end up being right, and angry.
- xenonite 6y ago
  Depends on whom you ask. For many if not most computer people, "hacking" is synonymous to coding, and indeed something very positive. In the public however, "hacking" is often more used synonymous to "cracking", which I find very unsettling and sad. At least there is nowadays some awareness that there is a different meaning to it. I guess that the word "hackathon" helped to change the public perception.
- dionidium 6y ago
  For a certain cohort that likely has a lot of exposure here on HN, "hacker" used to mean "good programmer" sounds perfectly normal.
- proverbialbunny 6y ago
  Hacking traditionally refers to prototyping like, "quickly hacking something up" and was pretty common in the Perl/dot com bubble days where everything was some clever hack, just to get it out the door as quickly as possible.

wiz21c 6y ago

I love software development as a creative task. It means, I love it when I do create, that is, when I make something that is the fruit of my imagination. Development is a nightmare for me when I have to develop someone else's (i.e. my company) idea. At that point, it's not creation anymore, it's execution.

proverbialbunny 6y ago
Me too. This is why I went into data science years ago. It's more difficult, but when correlated with difficulty you can get a good feel how creative the project is going to be.
- vharuck 6y ago
  Don't you have to make analyses and reports "production quality?" I found that fun at first, but now it's annoying when 25% of my code is formatting and capitalizing.
  - proverbialbunny 6y ago
    No, I'm not a machine learning software engineer, so no productionization on my end. I do find paths forward for the companies I've worked at but a report usually consists of a 1-to-1 with a c-suite pitching the project. If I've written a model, the notebook speaks for itself and naturally looks glorious with plots and what not. I have been known to create power point slides or do larger presentations. It is part of the job but I've never associated the terminology "production quality" with a presentation. >25% of my code is formatting and capitalizing. I haven't personally used it because by default I tend to write reasonably clean code but https://github.com/ryantam626/jupyterlab_code_formatter https://github.com/ryantam626/jupyterlab_code_formatter or similar might help.

gazzini 6y ago

I think these types of reflections are generally important — “the unexamined life is not worth living” and all that. Thanks for sharing! I was surprised by this sentence: > My measure for a well tested system? One that lets you deploy at 5pm on a Friday before confidently heading to the pub for a few pints with the team that just shipped. It feels... optimistic.

kharak 6y ago

I really like to hear more from people who don't care about coding or software development in general. I'd assume the majority of developers is not doing coding at home, as long as they don't have to learn a new skill for their next job. They neither hate nor love coding, they tolerate it as a means to an end. I also assume that those developers rise as much through the ranks as the love coding kind. At least that's my observation so far. Or to be more precise, I belive they more of the not loving kind rise through the ranks. But it's rare hearing from them. They don't care too much about what they do at work, at least not as a trade, hence no blogging. And we all feel that it's unwise to be open about not being pashioned about your work.

rrdharan 6y ago
I agree it does seem like there's a silent majority that is underrepresented sort of by definition :). I also share your sentiment in that I am kind of tired of reading evangelism from Developer Advocates/DevRel. There's inherently no skin in the game - they don't suffer if the snake oil they are promoting collapses in a mess of security violations, compliance concerns or productivity implosions two years later. Fundamentally it seems like you can't know if something really works unless you really try to build something with it and that takes 18+ months during which time you can't be out there shilling at conferences all day.
karatestomp 6y ago
> I'd assume the majority of developers is not doing coding at home, as long as they don't have to learn a new skill for their next job. They neither hate nor love coding, they tolerate it as a means to an end. Coding's fine. Sometimes fun. Our tools mostly suck though. I'm done fucking around with broken technology in my spare time, since I get more than enough of that at work (at this point I'd prefer zero time doing that), which means I'm mostly done with tech shit. These days I'd even get rid of home Internet if no-one in the house needed it for work or (increasingly) homework. Can buy more media than I need for the cost of broadband + media services, libraries exist, and books are better besides (one of the most truly valuable parts of the Internet is Library Genesis, which is illegal anyway, and is all about... books and journals). I was all about this stuff as a teenager. Now I wish I could find something that pays even close to as well that never, ever involved looking at a glowing screen. I'd absolutely love to go weeks without touching a computer.

truth_be_told 6y ago

Ah yes; a fluff piece with nothing in it. Article is named "Delight of Development" but of course the author is "not a developer anymore". >My focus now is less on building software myself, and more about enabling others build better software. Translation: I don't produce anything but lord it over people who do. What the hell is "Developer Relations"? Has the industry gone mad? Most of us got into programming because we enjoyed it; until the "Industry" with its useless "managemeent" layers destroyed our motivation/enjoyment of it and turned us into unhappy drones.