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Like other people are saying, there's definitely ways around this. The only reason why Taiwan has been so successful in battling Coronavirus is that there is na

Like other people are saying, there's definitely ways around this. The only reason why Taiwan has been so successful in battling Coronavirus is that there is national pride in acting as a whole and doing what's best for society. There is huge shame to the family for people who defy. Taiwanese people generally know what helps society and when to listen. It is the cultural influence/mix of Chinese and Japanese governments which are deeply ingrained. Source, I am Taiwanese.

impendia 6y ago
I envy you. I am American. I live near, and teach at, a large state university -- which has closed for the spring semester and moved to online instruction. This past Friday there was a house party across the street -- presumably all students. Usually I am very chill, but this time I called the cops.
- hanspedah 6y ago
  That behaviour reminds me of dark age where neighbours spied on each other and reported them to the government. And the thing that frightens me is that you and several others are doing this voluntarily.
  - Barrin92 6y ago
    there is absolutely no shame in reporting people to the government or the police who threaten the health of others by throwing a house party in the midst of a full blown pandemic, and to compare it to Stasi surveillance or whatever is disingenious and ignorant.
  - candu 6y ago
    ...except that, in said dark ages, that got people executed for treason or witchcraft or what have you. Here, it could very well save lives. Many democratic governments have tried voluntary restrictions - some people are complying, but others don't seem to care. What else is there but to enforce those restrictions via previously existing channels (e.g. Quarantine Act in Canada)? IMHO, this is similar to reporting someone for smoking near a public building, dangerous / drunk driving, or any of a number of public health / interest infractions.
    - hanspedah 6y ago
      It not only could but it saves lives, I'm not disputing that. But the question is at what cost to the individual, the society, the economy and their future. What happens if the economy crashes? Is it reasonable and the price worth paying? We should be allowed to not only ask these questions but discuss them.
      - impendia 6y ago
        > Is it reasonable and the price worth paying? It's a fair question, and it's one I considered before I called. I don't know what happened in the end. Very possibly nothing. I had hoped that a uniformed police officer would stop by, talk to the partiers, mention that there was a complaint, also mention something about COVID-19, urge people to go home, and then depart.
      - jarfil 6y ago
        If you want to ask those questions, you also need to ask what's the alternative. What happens if we continue business as usual and 5% of the population dies in a couple months? What if the virus mutates and another 5% die in the next couple months after that? What if immunity only lasts for half a year, and we get a 5% death rate every year from now on? Is it reasonable and the price worth paying?
        hanspedah 6y ago
        Where are you getting the 5% from? You're just adding the 5% on and on prior to "What if's" that don't sound plausible to me. Although if you did quote experts there I would like to know, that could change my view. To my current knowledge it is more and more looking like its fatality rate is sitting around 1%. People, especially older ones, die, we often supress that thought in the western culture. And many die, everyday. If the economy crashes many more will die most certainly.
        rhc2104 6y ago
        hanspedah, people believe 5% is the death rate that occurs if medical services are not available (and would thus be much higher than the death rate if medical services are available). And if there is no mitigation, the vast majority of people that would need medical care wouldn't be able to get it.
  - ambicapter 6y ago
    People in the US have called the cops on parties since time immemorial. I would say it depends 90% on how old your neighbors are.
  - jarfil 6y ago
    When someone threatens my life, I'm either going to call the cops, or try to kill them in self defense. Even if they're threatening someone else's life, you could still get away with killing them.
    - hanspedah 6y ago
      That fear and panic really got you it seems. Should we kill other people for infecting others with the seasonal flu virus as well, which also costs many lives per year? If you are endangered it is up to YOU to stay safe not the other way around. Do you know how many people die of car accidents? Should we kill all drivers just because they are potentially threatning someone elses life?
      - jarfil 6y ago
        That's what I said: if I am endangered, it is up to ME to remove the danger. Which, until there is a vaccine for the virus, means to remove all potential carriers from my surroundings. And don't start me on car drivers; there are accidents, and there are people willingly driving while intoxicated. The later should be shot on sight.
        dang 6y ago
        Would you please stop posting these violent things to HN? It's not in the spirit of this site, at all. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
  - dang 6y ago
    Please don't take HN threads further into flamewar. Even if you're right, this helps no one and degrades this place. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- yongjik 6y ago
  As a resident of the USA, thank you for your service.
landryraccoon 6y ago
I don’t think it’s only culture and this just happened by itself. The leadership of President Tsai Ing-wen (蔡英文) surely was a factor as well. Culture works in conjunction with good policy and leadership. I would be wary of attributing too much to the relatively immutable and hand-wavy notion of culture.
- autojoechen 6y ago
  Their VP is also an epidemiologist by training, a public health researcher, and was the health minister during the SARS epidemic [0] so definitely seems like the right person in the right job at the right time. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chen_Chien-jen https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chen_Chien-jen
- unityByFreedom 6y ago
  Absolutely, the opposing candidate was very pro-unification with China. With Tsai they got sensibility and a former health minister as VP.
unityByFreedom 6y ago
> The only reason why Taiwan has been so successful in battling Coronavirus is that there is national pride in acting as a whole and doing what's best for society I disagree. There are idiots in Taiwan that can ruin it just like anywhere. One nightclubber violating quarantine was just fined the amount cited in this article ($30k USD). Taiwan has been able to control the virus as a direct result of electing Tsai Ing-wen in January 2020. Her Vice President managed the SARS outbreak for Taiwan in 2002-2004, and since Taiwan was not allowed to participate in the WHO, they had to figure out for themselves how to deal with that outbreak. They are now better prepared. Tsai Ing-wen's opposing candidate, Han Kuo-yu, wanted to unify with China. He appeared to have momentum from winning the mayoral election in Kaohsiung, which is the 2nd largest city in Taiwan. Prior to his win there in 2018, Kaohsiung had always had a DPP mayor, DPP having been founded by people who fought for an end to martial law and the beginning of elections. In fact, the elections in Taiwan were on January 11 and may have played a role in China's delay in notifying the world community about the outbreak. The doctor who wanted to share the news (and has since died due to contracting the virus) was detained on January 1st, and China did not announce the outbreak until January 20th. Chinese-backed media was pushing Han Kuo-yu very hard during this election, spreading lots of fake news, and it was not clear whether or not he would pull an out-of-nowhere win like the other right-wing nuts who've been elected all over the world. Had he been elected, things would be different. I doubt he would have shut down flights to China. Fortunately, the Taiwanese people gave Tsai Ing-wen the biggest margin of victory Taiwan has ever seen in a presidential election.

impendia 6y ago

I envy you. I am American. I live near, and teach at, a large state university -- which has closed for the spring semester and moved to online instruction. This past Friday there was a house party across the street -- presumably all students. Usually I am very chill, but this time I called the cops.

hanspedah 6y ago
That behaviour reminds me of dark age where neighbours spied on each other and reported them to the government. And the thing that frightens me is that you and several others are doing this voluntarily.
- Barrin92 6y ago
  there is absolutely no shame in reporting people to the government or the police who threaten the health of others by throwing a house party in the midst of a full blown pandemic, and to compare it to Stasi surveillance or whatever is disingenious and ignorant.
- candu 6y ago
  ...except that, in said dark ages, that got people executed for treason or witchcraft or what have you. Here, it could very well save lives. Many democratic governments have tried voluntary restrictions - some people are complying, but others don't seem to care. What else is there but to enforce those restrictions via previously existing channels (e.g. Quarantine Act in Canada)? IMHO, this is similar to reporting someone for smoking near a public building, dangerous / drunk driving, or any of a number of public health / interest infractions.
  - hanspedah 6y ago
    It not only could but it saves lives, I'm not disputing that. But the question is at what cost to the individual, the society, the economy and their future. What happens if the economy crashes? Is it reasonable and the price worth paying? We should be allowed to not only ask these questions but discuss them.
    - impendia 6y ago
      > Is it reasonable and the price worth paying? It's a fair question, and it's one I considered before I called. I don't know what happened in the end. Very possibly nothing. I had hoped that a uniformed police officer would stop by, talk to the partiers, mention that there was a complaint, also mention something about COVID-19, urge people to go home, and then depart.
    - jarfil 6y ago
      If you want to ask those questions, you also need to ask what's the alternative. What happens if we continue business as usual and 5% of the population dies in a couple months? What if the virus mutates and another 5% die in the next couple months after that? What if immunity only lasts for half a year, and we get a 5% death rate every year from now on? Is it reasonable and the price worth paying?
      - hanspedah 6y ago
        Where are you getting the 5% from? You're just adding the 5% on and on prior to "What if's" that don't sound plausible to me. Although if you did quote experts there I would like to know, that could change my view. To my current knowledge it is more and more looking like its fatality rate is sitting around 1%. People, especially older ones, die, we often supress that thought in the western culture. And many die, everyday. If the economy crashes many more will die most certainly.
        rhc2104 6y ago
        hanspedah, people believe 5% is the death rate that occurs if medical services are not available (and would thus be much higher than the death rate if medical services are available). And if there is no mitigation, the vast majority of people that would need medical care wouldn't be able to get it.
- ambicapter 6y ago
  People in the US have called the cops on parties since time immemorial. I would say it depends 90% on how old your neighbors are.
- jarfil 6y ago
  When someone threatens my life, I'm either going to call the cops, or try to kill them in self defense. Even if they're threatening someone else's life, you could still get away with killing them.
  - hanspedah 6y ago
    That fear and panic really got you it seems. Should we kill other people for infecting others with the seasonal flu virus as well, which also costs many lives per year? If you are endangered it is up to YOU to stay safe not the other way around. Do you know how many people die of car accidents? Should we kill all drivers just because they are potentially threatning someone elses life?
    - jarfil 6y ago
      That's what I said: if I am endangered, it is up to ME to remove the danger. Which, until there is a vaccine for the virus, means to remove all potential carriers from my surroundings. And don't start me on car drivers; there are accidents, and there are people willingly driving while intoxicated. The later should be shot on sight.
      - dang 6y ago
        Would you please stop posting these violent things to HN? It's not in the spirit of this site, at all. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- dang 6y ago
  Please don't take HN threads further into flamewar. Even if you're right, this helps no one and degrades this place. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
yongjik 6y ago
As a resident of the USA, thank you for your service.

landryraccoon 6y ago

I don’t think it’s only culture and this just happened by itself. The leadership of President Tsai Ing-wen (蔡英文) surely was a factor as well. Culture works in conjunction with good policy and leadership. I would be wary of attributing too much to the relatively immutable and hand-wavy notion of culture.

autojoechen 6y ago
Their VP is also an epidemiologist by training, a public health researcher, and was the health minister during the SARS epidemic [0] so definitely seems like the right person in the right job at the right time. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chen_Chien-jen https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chen_Chien-jen
unityByFreedom 6y ago
Absolutely, the opposing candidate was very pro-unification with China. With Tsai they got sensibility and a former health minister as VP.

unityByFreedom 6y ago

> The only reason why Taiwan has been so successful in battling Coronavirus is that there is national pride in acting as a whole and doing what's best for society I disagree. There are idiots in Taiwan that can ruin it just like anywhere. One nightclubber violating quarantine was just fined the amount cited in this article ($30k USD). Taiwan has been able to control the virus as a direct result of electing Tsai Ing-wen in January 2020. Her Vice President managed the SARS outbreak for Taiwan in 2002-2004, and since Taiwan was not allowed to participate in the WHO, they had to figure out for themselves how to deal with that outbreak. They are now better prepared. Tsai Ing-wen's opposing candidate, Han Kuo-yu, wanted to unify with China. He appeared to have momentum from winning the mayoral election in Kaohsiung, which is the 2nd largest city in Taiwan. Prior to his win there in 2018, Kaohsiung had always had a DPP mayor, DPP having been founded by people who fought for an end to martial law and the beginning of elections. In fact, the elections in Taiwan were on January 11 and may have played a role in China's delay in notifying the world community about the outbreak. The doctor who wanted to share the news (and has since died due to contracting the virus) was detained on January 1st, and China did not announce the outbreak until January 20th. Chinese-backed media was pushing Han Kuo-yu very hard during this election, spreading lots of fake news, and it was not clear whether or not he would pull an out-of-nowhere win like the other right-wing nuts who've been elected all over the world. Had he been elected, things would be different. I doubt he would have shut down flights to China. Fortunately, the Taiwanese people gave Tsai Ing-wen the biggest margin of victory Taiwan has ever seen in a presidential election.