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I was watching one of the lectures on "Power Politics" that got upload to the Yale youtube recently. They cover this in one of the lectures. They show video of

I was watching one of the lectures on "Power Politics" that got upload to the Yale youtube recently. They cover this in one of the lectures. They show video of two monkeys in cages. One if given cucumber. It's content. Then the researcher gives the other monkey a grape. The monkey with the cucumber now throws out its cucumber, and rattles the cage when it doesn't get grapes. The Yale presenter as an interesting interpretation of it, that it's not a protest against inequality. The monkey is not enraged that the research has a bowl full of cucumbers and grapes, it's furious that another monkey in a cage just like it, is getting grapes instead of cucumbers. https://youtu.be/q53DF6ySOZg?t=2341 https://youtu.be/q53DF6ySOZg?t=2341

alamaslah 7y ago
What happens if you give them both grapes?
- mannykannot 7y ago
  They will not work for cucumber any more?
brighton36 7y ago
this series is phenomenal
everdev 7y ago
> it's not a protest against inequality. ...it's furious that another monkey in a cage just like it, is getting grapes instead of cucumbers. Isn't that inequality? It sounds like if it's equal (both get grapes or both get cucumbers) everything is fine.
- e12e 7y ago
  The researcher has much of both. But yes, if the monkey only compares itself with the other primate in a cage...
  - tsimionescu 7y ago
    Sure, but that's the problem with inequality: we're not mad at birds because they can fly and we can't - we're too different. But we are naturally mad at other humans, who are 99.99% identical to us but who live vastly different lives through accidents of birth or sometimes business success.
- elfexec 7y ago
  The study's implications are far more nuanced than that. If it was about inequality, the monkeys would be outraged that the human researcher has so many cucumbers and grapes. The study is implying that people/monkeys get agitated only when people/monkeys of their own perceived level/rank/group do better. For example, you and your brother aren't be agitated because your dad has all the money. That inequality doesn't bother you. But if your dad gave you $10 and your brother $100, I'm sure you'd get upset. Or if your company's payroll was leaked, you aren't upset that the founder of the company is making so much than you. But if you found out your fellow co-workers made more than you, you'd be pissed. So the study is implying the inequality issue is more about people seeing other people their own level getting ahead rather than seeing the uber wealthy getting richer. I believe there are other studies in psychology with back this up. But whether you agree with the studies implications is up to you. Another interesting note is that the people who are most upset at zuckerburg and the new tech billionaires are the elite wealthy whom they surpassed in wealth.
mrob 7y ago
It's the only protest against inequality that has any realistic chance of succeeding. A monkey isn't going to seize the means of grape production.
- DataWorker 7y ago
  Put enough of them together in a room with typewriters and they just might.
- gumby 7y ago
  You sure? They have opposable thumbs.
coldtea 7y ago
>The Yale presenter as an interesting interpretation of it, that it's not a protest against inequality. The monkey is not enraged that the research has a bowl full of cucumbers and grapes, it's furious that another monkey in a cage just like it, is getting grapes instead of cucumbers. Well, it's still inequality. It's just not ine-quantity. Each gets something different -- whether we perceive them as equal market value is not probably relevant to the monkey.

alamaslah 7y ago

What happens if you give them both grapes?

mannykannot 7y ago
They will not work for cucumber any more?

brighton36 7y ago

this series is phenomenal

everdev 7y ago

> it's not a protest against inequality. ...it's furious that another monkey in a cage just like it, is getting grapes instead of cucumbers. Isn't that inequality? It sounds like if it's equal (both get grapes or both get cucumbers) everything is fine.

e12e 7y ago
The researcher has much of both. But yes, if the monkey only compares itself with the other primate in a cage...
- tsimionescu 7y ago
  Sure, but that's the problem with inequality: we're not mad at birds because they can fly and we can't - we're too different. But we are naturally mad at other humans, who are 99.99% identical to us but who live vastly different lives through accidents of birth or sometimes business success.
elfexec 7y ago
The study's implications are far more nuanced than that. If it was about inequality, the monkeys would be outraged that the human researcher has so many cucumbers and grapes. The study is implying that people/monkeys get agitated only when people/monkeys of their own perceived level/rank/group do better. For example, you and your brother aren't be agitated because your dad has all the money. That inequality doesn't bother you. But if your dad gave you $10 and your brother $100, I'm sure you'd get upset. Or if your company's payroll was leaked, you aren't upset that the founder of the company is making so much than you. But if you found out your fellow co-workers made more than you, you'd be pissed. So the study is implying the inequality issue is more about people seeing other people their own level getting ahead rather than seeing the uber wealthy getting richer. I believe there are other studies in psychology with back this up. But whether you agree with the studies implications is up to you. Another interesting note is that the people who are most upset at zuckerburg and the new tech billionaires are the elite wealthy whom they surpassed in wealth.

mrob 7y ago

It's the only protest against inequality that has any realistic chance of succeeding. A monkey isn't going to seize the means of grape production.

DataWorker 7y ago
Put enough of them together in a room with typewriters and they just might.
gumby 7y ago
You sure? They have opposable thumbs.

coldtea 7y ago

>The Yale presenter as an interesting interpretation of it, that it's not a protest against inequality. The monkey is not enraged that the research has a bowl full of cucumbers and grapes, it's furious that another monkey in a cage just like it, is getting grapes instead of cucumbers. Well, it's still inequality. It's just not ine-quantity. Each gets something different -- whether we perceive them as equal market value is not probably relevant to the monkey.