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There is no bigger lie than hard work = prosperity. It is literally the exact opposite. Think of the hardest shittiest jobs and they are almost always the least

There is no bigger lie than hard work = prosperity. It is literally the exact opposite. Think of the hardest shittiest jobs and they are almost always the least paying. The richer you get the less hard work is, until you're able to reach the pinnacle of doing absolutely nothing but managing your money and taking advantage of discounted cap gains taxes. I grew up rich with every opportunity and never had one of these jobs, but it's clear as day. To get more money you have to pry it from people's hands. You have to have something they can't resist not paying you for. That's it. The suffering of low minimum wage is supposed to "encourage" people to move up the value chain, as the conservative doctrine goes, but it just doesn't work when all your time and energy is spent surviving.

duxup 7y ago
So true. Honestly, I only made it out (I was probabbly not going to make it through college due to all the work and my own personality when I was young was NOT ready for college) because I got lucky, had some mild technical skills and the .com era came along and companies wanted warm bodies. I picked some aged old company and they hired me. That company stuck around for a long enough time to establish a career. Working pizza ... could easily have kept me down due to that and other challenges.
MisterOctober 7y ago
This is a damn good point. Whenever my friends, or kids of my friends, start talking about taking some foodservice or other really hard, low-paying job, I roundly encourage them to avoid it if remotely practical and build marketable skills and connections instead. Another bad thing about those types of jobs is that they can start to warp your mind after a while, to the effect that you start unconsciously considering your superiors / managers as role models, and start trying to 'move up the ladder' because the pay is marginally better, when in reality most of the time the _top_ of the "ladder" at such organizations are compensated less than entry-level positions for in-demand skilled workers -- I've been continuously employed [out of what I _thought_ was necessity] since I was 16, and until I was about 26 the majority of my jobs were in the foodservice / warehouse / gofer / etc hard-work-long-hours-very-low-pay category. If I had to do over again, I would have stayed away from those situations by any means available and used that time to build valuable skills [as I later did], which would almost certainly have resulted in better outcomes, sooner.
lurquer 7y ago
>There is no bigger lie than hard work = prosperity. It is literally the exact opposite. Hard work leads to prosperity. That's not the same as equating prosperity to hard work. Most prosperous people achieved prosperity due to earlier hard work and sacrifice of themselves (or their immediate ancestors.) Clearly, the 'value chain', as you put it, exists as evidenced by the numerous posts on this thread of describing the previous fast-food-type jobs they held that led them to more 'prosperous' positions (at least, affording enough prosperity to spend time posting messages to the internet instead of digging ditches or flipping burgers.)
- venatiodecorus 7y ago
  the lie is working :)
- thinkloop 7y ago
  The problem with this discussion is the definition of "hard". Is pushing a rock up and down a mountain easier or harder than getting a degree in computers? For me it's the former, studying cool stuff in cafes seems "easier".
- jfk13 7y ago
  > Hard work leads to prosperity. Sometimes it does. Other times, it's barely enough to achieve survival. > Most prosperous people achieved prosperity due to earlier hard work and sacrifice of themselves (or their immediate ancestors.) Or their distant ancestors. Or due to their -- or their ancestors' -- criminal activities or exploitative behavior or sheer luck.
  - lurquer 7y ago
    It's odd how the same people who are prone to excuse criminals on the basis of the criminal's poverty, so frequently accuse rich people of having obtained their wealth through illicit means.
    - dragonsngoblins 7y ago
      Eh not really. The idea that stealing because you need to in order to eat/have a place to sleep being a lesser crime than stealing to be wealthy makes a lot of sense to me.
Kaveren 7y ago
The hard work part is studying so you have a skillset.
JordanFarmer 7y ago
hard work = prosperity, I don't think I have ever seen or heard that without further advice or instruction. Hard work is only one component toward advancement. You have to have a plan to advance and make good choices as well.

duxup 7y ago

So true. Honestly, I only made it out (I was probabbly not going to make it through college due to all the work and my own personality when I was young was NOT ready for college) because I got lucky, had some mild technical skills and the .com era came along and companies wanted warm bodies. I picked some aged old company and they hired me. That company stuck around for a long enough time to establish a career. Working pizza ... could easily have kept me down due to that and other challenges.

MisterOctober 7y ago

This is a damn good point. Whenever my friends, or kids of my friends, start talking about taking some foodservice or other really hard, low-paying job, I roundly encourage them to avoid it if remotely practical and build marketable skills and connections instead. Another bad thing about those types of jobs is that they can start to warp your mind after a while, to the effect that you start unconsciously considering your superiors / managers as role models, and start trying to 'move up the ladder' because the pay is marginally better, when in reality most of the time the _top_ of the "ladder" at such organizations are compensated less than entry-level positions for in-demand skilled workers -- I've been continuously employed [out of what I _thought_ was necessity] since I was 16, and until I was about 26 the majority of my jobs were in the foodservice / warehouse / gofer / etc hard-work-long-hours-very-low-pay category. If I had to do over again, I would have stayed away from those situations by any means available and used that time to build valuable skills [as I later did], which would almost certainly have resulted in better outcomes, sooner.

lurquer 7y ago

>There is no bigger lie than hard work = prosperity. It is literally the exact opposite. Hard work leads to prosperity. That's not the same as equating prosperity to hard work. Most prosperous people achieved prosperity due to earlier hard work and sacrifice of themselves (or their immediate ancestors.) Clearly, the 'value chain', as you put it, exists as evidenced by the numerous posts on this thread of describing the previous fast-food-type jobs they held that led them to more 'prosperous' positions (at least, affording enough prosperity to spend time posting messages to the internet instead of digging ditches or flipping burgers.)

venatiodecorus 7y ago
the lie is working :)
thinkloop 7y ago
The problem with this discussion is the definition of "hard". Is pushing a rock up and down a mountain easier or harder than getting a degree in computers? For me it's the former, studying cool stuff in cafes seems "easier".
jfk13 7y ago
> Hard work leads to prosperity. Sometimes it does. Other times, it's barely enough to achieve survival. > Most prosperous people achieved prosperity due to earlier hard work and sacrifice of themselves (or their immediate ancestors.) Or their distant ancestors. Or due to their -- or their ancestors' -- criminal activities or exploitative behavior or sheer luck.
- lurquer 7y ago
  It's odd how the same people who are prone to excuse criminals on the basis of the criminal's poverty, so frequently accuse rich people of having obtained their wealth through illicit means.
  - dragonsngoblins 7y ago
    Eh not really. The idea that stealing because you need to in order to eat/have a place to sleep being a lesser crime than stealing to be wealthy makes a lot of sense to me.

Kaveren 7y ago

The hard work part is studying so you have a skillset.

JordanFarmer 7y ago

hard work = prosperity, I don't think I have ever seen or heard that without further advice or instruction. Hard work is only one component toward advancement. You have to have a plan to advance and make good choices as well.