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Adobe Provides facial recognition Software for DHS and ICE

icegreentea2 7y ago
Where does it say they provide facial recognition software? I looked through the attached "Limited Sources Justification" PDF and the three areas they claim to be using Adobe software for are "Digital Media" (this is Acrobat and Reader), "Digital Marketing" (Creative Suite) and "Digital Meetings". Maybe this is the wrong contract??
- rammy1234 7y ago
  If this is wrong why is this not still taken out ?
- duncan-donuts 7y ago
  The only thing I can come up with is there is a part that says something like “user-facing, business-facing” which seems like what may have been confused? The LSG only talks about using well known adobe products. https://www.fbo.gov/utils/view?id=6f4e5737cc7bd661210bf567664a3f9a https://www.fbo.gov/utils/view?id=6f4e5737cc7bd661210bf56766...
  - benologist 7y ago
    They put money-recognition into Photoshop in the past - https://petapixel.com/2011/08/09/heres-what-happens-when-you-try-to-edit-photos-of-money-in-photoshop/ https://petapixel.com/2011/08/09/heres-what-happens-when-you... So perhaps they are putting facial-recognition in too? https://www.theverge.com/2019/6/14/18678782/adobe-machine-learning-ai-tool-spot-fake-facial-edits-liquify-manipulations https://www.theverge.com/2019/6/14/18678782/adobe-machine-le...
- twhitmore 7y ago
  Agree -- I scanned this myself, looking for the 'Facial Recognition' mentions. Broadly this seems a justification to purchase Adobe by brand (rather than competitive tendering) for Digital Media, Digital Marketing, and Digital Meeting functionalities. Pretty hi-tech stuff, but from what I could gather "Digital Media" means using Acrobat/ Reader for forms. Much as I dislike Adobe, there doesn't seem much going on here.
jaboutboul 7y ago
Where does this discuss facial recognition? All I see is information related to the standard Adobe products, Acrobat/PDF, Creative Suite and others. They may be used in support for a facial recognition application but that’s all I see.
manigandham 7y ago
It's perfectly legal and fine for companies to provide products and services to their home governments. What's the issue here?
- adamnemecek 7y ago
  Legal maybe, moral idk, given what they do.
  - manigandham 7y ago
    If there's a morality issue, that should be directed at the government.
    - adamnemecek 7y ago
      Why? This way also works. Good luck changing the govt.
      - manigandham 7y ago
        This way just creates chaos and rarely results in any long-term change. And the government changes all the time. It's called voting, and interacting with your representatives. If you have time to be outraged at corporations then you certainly have time to be involved with politics to create change.
    - JohnFen 7y ago
      There's nothing wrong with holding a moral lens to all entities, government and private.
    - phs318u 7y ago
      Why? Both corporations and governments are, in theory, supposed to take actions that maximise benefit to their stakeholders. If those stakeholders decide in the majority that morality is a way in which they seek to derive value from either a corporation or a government then those institutions are presumably bound to deliver on those requirements or to be subsequently punished by the majority or their stakeholders. The fact that shareholders (and customers) seem to be more inclined to be demanding moral behaviours from companies, even though they are also (presumably) citizens, is possibly an indication of the fact companies are more responsive in this regard. EDIT: autocorrect
nwrk 7y ago
The title is false. There is no mention of facial recognition.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
someonehere 7y ago
I like how people are being trained Pavlovian style to go after tech companies that provide services to alphabet agencies with this administration. Did people complain with the last administration? Will people complain with the next administration? Whether you agree or not with the current administration, the government still needs to operate and keep in line with technology. If you are angry with how DHS and ICE operate, what do you propose? Jeopardize the safety Americans for what benefit?
- manigandham 7y ago
  HN/Silicon Valley/tech is extremely left-leaning but seems to forget that SV was borne out of warfare. It has close ties to the military from research to investment and many of our advanced technologies today are from defense projects. Complaining about such things is usually a luxury by people who have never experienced the serious crime and poverty that exists in the world and afflicts billions everyday. In a way, it's a good thing that life can be so comfortable, but it also causes a loss in perspective.
natalyarostova 7y ago
Great. Glad American software companies are working with our government to help enforce our laws!
loraa 7y ago
Ok, so congrats to Adobe for helping to keep the law.

Where does it say they provide facial recognition software? I looked through the attached "Limited Sources Justification" PDF and the three areas they claim to be using Adobe software for are "Digital Media" (this is Acrobat and Reader), "Digital Marketing" (Creative Suite) and "Digital Meetings". Maybe this is the wrong contract??

rammy1234 7y ago
If this is wrong why is this not still taken out ?
duncan-donuts 7y ago
The only thing I can come up with is there is a part that says something like “user-facing, business-facing” which seems like what may have been confused? The LSG only talks about using well known adobe products. https://www.fbo.gov/utils/view?id=6f4e5737cc7bd661210bf567664a3f9a https://www.fbo.gov/utils/view?id=6f4e5737cc7bd661210bf56766...
- benologist 7y ago
  They put money-recognition into Photoshop in the past - https://petapixel.com/2011/08/09/heres-what-happens-when-you-try-to-edit-photos-of-money-in-photoshop/ https://petapixel.com/2011/08/09/heres-what-happens-when-you... So perhaps they are putting facial-recognition in too? https://www.theverge.com/2019/6/14/18678782/adobe-machine-learning-ai-tool-spot-fake-facial-edits-liquify-manipulations https://www.theverge.com/2019/6/14/18678782/adobe-machine-le...
twhitmore 7y ago
Agree -- I scanned this myself, looking for the 'Facial Recognition' mentions. Broadly this seems a justification to purchase Adobe by brand (rather than competitive tendering) for Digital Media, Digital Marketing, and Digital Meeting functionalities. Pretty hi-tech stuff, but from what I could gather "Digital Media" means using Acrobat/ Reader for forms. Much as I dislike Adobe, there doesn't seem much going on here.

jaboutboul 7y ago

Where does this discuss facial recognition? All I see is information related to the standard Adobe products, Acrobat/PDF, Creative Suite and others. They may be used in support for a facial recognition application but that’s all I see.

manigandham 7y ago

It's perfectly legal and fine for companies to provide products and services to their home governments. What's the issue here?

adamnemecek 7y ago
Legal maybe, moral idk, given what they do.
- manigandham 7y ago
  If there's a morality issue, that should be directed at the government.
  - adamnemecek 7y ago
    Why? This way also works. Good luck changing the govt.
    - manigandham 7y ago
      This way just creates chaos and rarely results in any long-term change. And the government changes all the time. It's called voting, and interacting with your representatives. If you have time to be outraged at corporations then you certainly have time to be involved with politics to create change.
  - JohnFen 7y ago
    There's nothing wrong with holding a moral lens to all entities, government and private.
  - phs318u 7y ago
    Why? Both corporations and governments are, in theory, supposed to take actions that maximise benefit to their stakeholders. If those stakeholders decide in the majority that morality is a way in which they seek to derive value from either a corporation or a government then those institutions are presumably bound to deliver on those requirements or to be subsequently punished by the majority or their stakeholders. The fact that shareholders (and customers) seem to be more inclined to be demanding moral behaviours from companies, even though they are also (presumably) citizens, is possibly an indication of the fact companies are more responsive in this regard. EDIT: autocorrect

nwrk 7y ago

The title is false. There is no mention of facial recognition.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

someonehere 7y ago

I like how people are being trained Pavlovian style to go after tech companies that provide services to alphabet agencies with this administration. Did people complain with the last administration? Will people complain with the next administration? Whether you agree or not with the current administration, the government still needs to operate and keep in line with technology. If you are angry with how DHS and ICE operate, what do you propose? Jeopardize the safety Americans for what benefit?

manigandham 7y ago
HN/Silicon Valley/tech is extremely left-leaning but seems to forget that SV was borne out of warfare. It has close ties to the military from research to investment and many of our advanced technologies today are from defense projects. Complaining about such things is usually a luxury by people who have never experienced the serious crime and poverty that exists in the world and afflicts billions everyday. In a way, it's a good thing that life can be so comfortable, but it also causes a loss in perspective.

natalyarostova 7y ago

Great. Glad American software companies are working with our government to help enforce our laws!

loraa 7y ago

Ok, so congrats to Adobe for helping to keep the law.