5 ms·

Ehm why is this newsworthy? It was repeatedly shown to be nothing..

eitland 7y ago
Probably showed up today because it happened exactly 40 years ago.
NotSammyHagar 7y ago
Can you give pointers to the external information showing where it's repeatedly shown to be nothing? The wikipedia description sound very plausible.
- ars 7y ago
  Did we read the same article in wikipedia? It quotes many many sources saying it was not a nuclear test. The quotes that it was a test were from journalists, and from people who "heard" about it. None from actual scientists who studied it.
  - krisoft 7y ago
    Very good question. The article I'm reading says "Today, most independent researchers believe that the 1979 flash was caused by a nuclear explosion" What does yours say?
    - ars 7y ago
      Read the details that discuss the available evidence. Not just the summary at the top which is not supported by the rest of the article.
      - Buge 7y ago
        It sounds like early on the US government said it was inconclusive in order to not offend South Africa and Israel. But more recently, people have been saying it was a nuclear test. > A December 2016 report by William Burr and Avner Cohen of George Washington University's National Security Archive and Nuclear Proliferation International History Project noted that the debate over the South Atlantic flash has shifted over the last few years, on the side of a man-made weapon test.[1] The National Security Archive briefing concluded: >> A Central Intelligence Agency-sponsored panel of well-respected scientists concluded that a mysterious flash detected by a U.S. Vela satellite over the South Atlantic on the night of 22 September 1979 was likely a nuclear test. > The newly released research and subsequent report was largely based upon recently declassified documents in files at the National Archives of Gerard C. Smith, a former Ambassador and special envoy on nuclear nonproliferation during Jimmy Carter's presidency.[1][60][5] Smith had once said: "I was never able to break free from the thought that the event was a joint operation between Israel and South Africa." The documents cited a June 1980 U.S. State Department report where Defense Intelligence Agency Vice Director Jack Varona had said the ensuing U.S. investigation was a "white wash, due to political considerations" based on "flimsy evidence". He added that the "weight of the evidence pointed towards a nuclear event" and cited hydroacoustic data analyzed by the Naval Research Laboratory. The data, he suggested, involved "signals ... unique to nuclear shots in a maritime environment" and emanating from the area of "shallow waters between Prince Edward and Marion Islands, south-east of South Africa".[1][5][60] > In 2018, a new study made the case for the double flash being a nuclear test.[6][7][61][62]
salex89 7y ago
This is a fresh, possibly more substantiated article: https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/09/22/blast-from-the-past-vela-satellite-israel-nuclear-double-flash-1979-ptbt-south-atlantic-south-africa/ https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/09/22/blast-from-the-past-vel... The interesting fact is that there is very little speak of any other nation carrying out a nuclear test. It boiled down to Israel and South Africa, or a sensor glitch/weather fenomena. Kind of fun that the two nations vere the prime suspects although officially "nothing happened".
- EdwardDiego 7y ago
  Also that the 'glitch' happened to occur in very close proximity to two uninhabited* subantarctic islands controlled by South Africa - and that sheep in Western Australia showed higher levels of iodine 131. *Permanently uninhabited, but there's a research base there.
  - fleetingmoments 7y ago
    I spent a year on that island in 2010/2011. There has never been a time where there weren't research personnel at the station since the 50s. It's very hard to believe a nuclear test would be carried out without concern for the safety of the overwintering team or without anybody noticing.
    - EdwardDiego 7y ago
      > It's very hard to believe a nuclear test would be carried out without concern for the safety of the overwintering team or without anybody noticing. Atomic tests have routinely been carried out with scientific observers nearby, I mean, it's sorta the point of doing one. And as for people noticing, I would imagine apartheid South Africa had their own equivalent of an Official Secrets Act.
      - fleetingmoments 7y ago
        The team members were Meteorologists and Biologists, not nuclear observers. You can find the team and their names here. http://blogs.sun.ac.za/antarcticlegacy/reference-materials/marion-island-teams/ http://blogs.sun.ac.za/antarcticlegacy/reference-materials/m...
dwighttk 7y ago
40 yr anniversary

Probably showed up today because it happened exactly 40 years ago.

Can you give pointers to the external information showing where it's repeatedly shown to be nothing? The wikipedia description sound very plausible.

ars 7y ago
Did we read the same article in wikipedia? It quotes many many sources saying it was not a nuclear test. The quotes that it was a test were from journalists, and from people who "heard" about it. None from actual scientists who studied it.
- krisoft 7y ago
  Very good question. The article I'm reading says "Today, most independent researchers believe that the 1979 flash was caused by a nuclear explosion" What does yours say?
  - ars 7y ago
    Read the details that discuss the available evidence. Not just the summary at the top which is not supported by the rest of the article.
    - Buge 7y ago
      It sounds like early on the US government said it was inconclusive in order to not offend South Africa and Israel. But more recently, people have been saying it was a nuclear test. > A December 2016 report by William Burr and Avner Cohen of George Washington University's National Security Archive and Nuclear Proliferation International History Project noted that the debate over the South Atlantic flash has shifted over the last few years, on the side of a man-made weapon test.[1] The National Security Archive briefing concluded: >> A Central Intelligence Agency-sponsored panel of well-respected scientists concluded that a mysterious flash detected by a U.S. Vela satellite over the South Atlantic on the night of 22 September 1979 was likely a nuclear test. > The newly released research and subsequent report was largely based upon recently declassified documents in files at the National Archives of Gerard C. Smith, a former Ambassador and special envoy on nuclear nonproliferation during Jimmy Carter's presidency.[1][60][5] Smith had once said: "I was never able to break free from the thought that the event was a joint operation between Israel and South Africa." The documents cited a June 1980 U.S. State Department report where Defense Intelligence Agency Vice Director Jack Varona had said the ensuing U.S. investigation was a "white wash, due to political considerations" based on "flimsy evidence". He added that the "weight of the evidence pointed towards a nuclear event" and cited hydroacoustic data analyzed by the Naval Research Laboratory. The data, he suggested, involved "signals ... unique to nuclear shots in a maritime environment" and emanating from the area of "shallow waters between Prince Edward and Marion Islands, south-east of South Africa".[1][5][60] > In 2018, a new study made the case for the double flash being a nuclear test.[6][7][61][62]

salex89 7y ago

This is a fresh, possibly more substantiated article: https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/09/22/blast-from-the-past-vela-satellite-israel-nuclear-double-flash-1979-ptbt-south-atlantic-south-africa/ https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/09/22/blast-from-the-past-vel... The interesting fact is that there is very little speak of any other nation carrying out a nuclear test. It boiled down to Israel and South Africa, or a sensor glitch/weather fenomena. Kind of fun that the two nations vere the prime suspects although officially "nothing happened".

EdwardDiego 7y ago
Also that the 'glitch' happened to occur in very close proximity to two uninhabited* subantarctic islands controlled by South Africa - and that sheep in Western Australia showed higher levels of iodine 131. *Permanently uninhabited, but there's a research base there.
- fleetingmoments 7y ago
  I spent a year on that island in 2010/2011. There has never been a time where there weren't research personnel at the station since the 50s. It's very hard to believe a nuclear test would be carried out without concern for the safety of the overwintering team or without anybody noticing.
  - EdwardDiego 7y ago
    > It's very hard to believe a nuclear test would be carried out without concern for the safety of the overwintering team or without anybody noticing. Atomic tests have routinely been carried out with scientific observers nearby, I mean, it's sorta the point of doing one. And as for people noticing, I would imagine apartheid South Africa had their own equivalent of an Official Secrets Act.
    - fleetingmoments 7y ago
      The team members were Meteorologists and Biologists, not nuclear observers. You can find the team and their names here. http://blogs.sun.ac.za/antarcticlegacy/reference-materials/marion-island-teams/ http://blogs.sun.ac.za/antarcticlegacy/reference-materials/m...

dwighttk 7y ago

40 yr anniversary