16 ms·

Overcome Fear in 2011. Get Rejected On Purpose

45 points by ambitious 16y ago

david_shaw 16y ago
Rejection therapy has gotten a lot of coverage on HN recently, and for good reason. A lot of people on the Internet use rejection therapy to get over their fears of asking the cute girl out for coffee or going to the trendy nightclub they've never entered before. Here at HN, however, I think rejection therapy is able to really shine: sitting down for lunch with some VC's or C-level executives takes courage, and pitching your idea is literally asking for it to get shot down. It takes a lot of courage, but in the end it's worth it to take the risk for the slim chance of reward. In fact, many aspects of the startup lifestyle involve putting your neck out there in hopes that someone will see your idea and love it just as much as you do. I haven't played the "Rejection Therapy" game, but I feel like everyone is afraid of getting rejected from something. It gives me the holiday season warm fuzzy feelings when I know that people are following a system that will improve themselves.
- randallsquared 16y ago
  sitting down for lunch with some VC's or C-level executives takes courage, and pitching your idea is literally asking for it to get shot down. ...where by "literally" you mean "figuratively". Unless VCs you lunch with habitually bring firearms or the like to lunch. :)
  - yan 16y ago
    "Literally" and "figuratively" mean the same things figuratively, but different literally.
  - jdminhbg 16y ago
    That depends on whether you think "literally" is modifying "asking" or "shot."
  - david_shaw 16y ago
    Well, I meant you were literally asking for critique, as opposed to just sitting down and fishing for empty compliments. Happy 2011, I just woke up and laughed at the thought of a VC with a rocket-propelled grenade.
jacobroufa 16y ago
This is great! One of the reasons 2010 has been so wonderful for me is because of the lack of fear I've had! It took awhile for me to get over all of this... half of 2008, all of 2009, and the beginning of 2010 were all wasted because I was too scared to do anything! Two years of my life could (and would) have been better spent working in a field I love on projects I enjoy with people that constantly push me to excel but because of the rejection I experienced (mostly in my own head, mind you) in the first half of 2008, I froze and was unable to get past it. Well, thank [insert higher power of choice here] for that because this year I'm back on the horse and 2011 brings nothing but amazing potential and a blank slate every day for me to fill. To anyone stuck where I was: Keep pushing forward. When you realize that the rejection is your own head working against you, you'll finally feel free. It gets different!
rorrr 16y ago
One great way of doing this is to interview for jobs that you think you're not qualified enough for. I've gone to so many interviews over the years, that after a while it doesn't matter if some company X doesn't take you. You just stop worrying. I have a couple of friends who never go to interviews, unless their skills match the job description almost perfectly. They rob themselves of chances to get more money, more experience. "Son, let women figure out why they won't screw you. Don't do it for them." -- Shit My Dad Says
- dustingetz 16y ago
  the value of interviewing for a job i'm underqualified for, even including rejection practice and promotion potential, probably isn't worth the time and effort.
  - nazgulnarsil 16y ago
    I think you overestimate the time and effort involved. a 1% chance to earn 20k more a year and learn new skills along the way is worth more than the $200/a few hours of my life a strict cost/benefit would indicate.
  - evgeny0 16y ago
    Agreed. You may also be ruling yourself out of consideration for future opportunities with the same company that you genuinely are qualified for, because you've created the perception that you're incompetent or just don't interview well. (Let's face it, it would be difficult to give good answers at the interview when you're clearly not qualified.)
  - digitallogic 16y ago
    I think you may be right for jobs you _are_ underqualified for, but what about all the jobs you only _think_ you're underqualified for? You really have no way of knowing if you're underqualified or not from the amount of information about any particular job you might come across (on a job board or a company's website). Now obviously they may list a bunch of technologies you've never worked for, but even then they might be willing to let a smart person learn.
sown 16y ago
For me, it's not so much fear but more as resignation. I can how an interview will end up within the first few minutes.
- anamax 16y ago
  > I can how an interview will end up within the first few minutes. Supposedly, that's also how long it takes the interviewer to decide.
dustingetz 16y ago
or just go learn how to pick up girls. the skills are relevant to entrepreneurs.
- brandnewlow 16y ago
  Dating hack of the year: http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/ekd1o/iam_my_own_okcupid_wingman_i_have_a_fake_profile/ http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/ekd1o/iam_my_own_okcup...
  - singular 16y ago
    Two interesting things about that thread - 1. he's gathering real data on women not just theorising, which is smart, 2. something you can't control - looks (fundamentally, obviously if you're very overweight [like me] you can fix that, same with the way you dress etc.) - has the biggest impact of all. Moral of the story - real data trumps everything, even if that data makes you realise you aren't entirely in control of the situation :)
- mindcrime 16y ago
  or just go learn how to pick up girls. the skills are relevant to entrepreneurs. In fact, the PUA guys have taken a lot of ideas from the exact same sources that are used by sales-people, marketers, etc. For example, Robert Cialdini's book Influence: The Psychology of Persuasion is a popular read amongst PUAs. You'll also see those guys recommending various books on sales and presentation skills, recommending improv classes (something else sales guys sometimes do), etc. So yeah, there's definitely a sort of connection there... :-)
buckwild 16y ago
you don't need to get rejected on purpose to overcome fear.
FrankBlack 16y ago
"This week, each one of you has a homework assignment. You're going to go out and start a fight with a total stranger... You're gonna start a fight...and you're gonna lose."
wwalker3 16y ago
Having to reject someone can be a very stressful experience. I don't like the idea of purposefully inflicting that stress on others unless there's a chance we both could benefit. "Getting rejected on purpose" sounds like I'd be picking situations where I know for sure I'll be rejected -- an inappropriate proposition, an undeserved request. I don't want to do that to someone else just to try to desensitize myself to rejection.
- tlb 16y ago
  Indeed, I shudder to imagine people following this advice and importuning others. The social contract among my peers seem to be to only ask for things that could be the start of a win-win negotiation.
  - dschobel 16y ago
    The whole point of the exercise is that people underestimate what is possible in any given situation and misjudge their opportunities.
forensic 16y ago
"Rejection Therapy" is the inaccurate, possibly dangerous meme version of a real therapy - in vivo desensitization. Conquering fear is done by facing your fears not by intentionally going out with the expectation that things will go bad. Pessimism is just another defence mechanism from the true vulnerability of ambiguity. This meme is just psychologically wrong in so many ways. - Seeking rejection creates a self-fulfilling prophecy where you will be more likely to be rejected. - When you are rejected in this way, instead of processing it maturely, you're going to say "Oh it was part of my rejection therapy. I didn't really even want or expect to be accepted. Add one point to the scoreboard!." This is an attempt to dodge the reality of what happened - rejection is a negative thing. It's not the end of the world, but it also is probably not cause for celebration. You aren't fooling anyone (including yourself) by telling yourself it is positive. Anytime you are rejected from something you care about you are going to have sad feelings at the least. The way to handle these is to face them, own them, feel them, realize they will go away, and try again another day. But inflicting this on yourself on purpose is masochism and unhealthy. - For most people, experiencing a lot of rejection will not make them less fearful of rejection, it will make them more fearful. They will come to expect rejection more and then avoid behaviours that they believe will lead to it. - The effective, scientifically proven way to face your fears is to do it piece by piece, in small bites, and to recognize that if you are not allowing yourself to be truly emotionally vulnerable, you are not really facing your fear of rejection. The fear of rejection is about asking for something you want and then feeling the uncomfortable vulnerable feelings of ambiguity. It's about making yourself emotionally vulnerable - you genuinely want something and will be happy to receive it and sad to be denied it. This is true vulnerability. You cannot avoid the pain of rejection, you can only learn to process it when it happens, and to have the courage to risk that pain because you know it's all for a greater good. But inflicting this pain on yourself needlessly is masochistic and will likely lead to more phobias and anxiety, not less. Those who are having trouble with fear - look up systematic desensitization and in vivo desensitization. Also, remember that true courage means allowing yourself to be vulnerable. And vulnerability means allowing for the instance where you feel bad. A coward is someone who finds ways to avoid any chance of feeling bad. A courageous person is one who is willing to risk losing something he desires because he knows that it is a smart risk.
- 16y ago

45 points by ambitious 16y ago

Rejection therapy has gotten a lot of coverage on HN recently, and for good reason. A lot of people on the Internet use rejection therapy to get over their fears of asking the cute girl out for coffee or going to the trendy nightclub they've never entered before. Here at HN, however, I think rejection therapy is able to really shine: sitting down for lunch with some VC's or C-level executives takes courage, and pitching your idea is literally asking for it to get shot down. It takes a lot of courage, but in the end it's worth it to take the risk for the slim chance of reward. In fact, many aspects of the startup lifestyle involve putting your neck out there in hopes that someone will see your idea and love it just as much as you do. I haven't played the "Rejection Therapy" game, but I feel like everyone is afraid of getting rejected from something. It gives me the holiday season warm fuzzy feelings when I know that people are following a system that will improve themselves.

randallsquared 16y ago
sitting down for lunch with some VC's or C-level executives takes courage, and pitching your idea is literally asking for it to get shot down. ...where by "literally" you mean "figuratively". Unless VCs you lunch with habitually bring firearms or the like to lunch. :)
- yan 16y ago
  "Literally" and "figuratively" mean the same things figuratively, but different literally.
- jdminhbg 16y ago
  That depends on whether you think "literally" is modifying "asking" or "shot."
- david_shaw 16y ago
  Well, I meant you were literally asking for critique, as opposed to just sitting down and fishing for empty compliments. Happy 2011, I just woke up and laughed at the thought of a VC with a rocket-propelled grenade.

jacobroufa 16y ago

This is great! One of the reasons 2010 has been so wonderful for me is because of the lack of fear I've had! It took awhile for me to get over all of this... half of 2008, all of 2009, and the beginning of 2010 were all wasted because I was too scared to do anything! Two years of my life could (and would) have been better spent working in a field I love on projects I enjoy with people that constantly push me to excel but because of the rejection I experienced (mostly in my own head, mind you) in the first half of 2008, I froze and was unable to get past it. Well, thank [insert higher power of choice here] for that because this year I'm back on the horse and 2011 brings nothing but amazing potential and a blank slate every day for me to fill. To anyone stuck where I was: Keep pushing forward. When you realize that the rejection is your own head working against you, you'll finally feel free. It gets different!

rorrr 16y ago

One great way of doing this is to interview for jobs that you think you're not qualified enough for. I've gone to so many interviews over the years, that after a while it doesn't matter if some company X doesn't take you. You just stop worrying. I have a couple of friends who never go to interviews, unless their skills match the job description almost perfectly. They rob themselves of chances to get more money, more experience. "Son, let women figure out why they won't screw you. Don't do it for them." -- Shit My Dad Says

dustingetz 16y ago
the value of interviewing for a job i'm underqualified for, even including rejection practice and promotion potential, probably isn't worth the time and effort.
- nazgulnarsil 16y ago
  I think you overestimate the time and effort involved. a 1% chance to earn 20k more a year and learn new skills along the way is worth more than the $200/a few hours of my life a strict cost/benefit would indicate.
- evgeny0 16y ago
  Agreed. You may also be ruling yourself out of consideration for future opportunities with the same company that you genuinely are qualified for, because you've created the perception that you're incompetent or just don't interview well. (Let's face it, it would be difficult to give good answers at the interview when you're clearly not qualified.)
- digitallogic 16y ago
  I think you may be right for jobs you _are_ underqualified for, but what about all the jobs you only _think_ you're underqualified for? You really have no way of knowing if you're underqualified or not from the amount of information about any particular job you might come across (on a job board or a company's website). Now obviously they may list a bunch of technologies you've never worked for, but even then they might be willing to let a smart person learn.

sown 16y ago

For me, it's not so much fear but more as resignation. I can how an interview will end up within the first few minutes.

anamax 16y ago
> I can how an interview will end up within the first few minutes. Supposedly, that's also how long it takes the interviewer to decide.

dustingetz 16y ago

or just go learn how to pick up girls. the skills are relevant to entrepreneurs.

brandnewlow 16y ago
Dating hack of the year: http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/ekd1o/iam_my_own_okcupid_wingman_i_have_a_fake_profile/ http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/ekd1o/iam_my_own_okcup...
- singular 16y ago
  Two interesting things about that thread - 1. he's gathering real data on women not just theorising, which is smart, 2. something you can't control - looks (fundamentally, obviously if you're very overweight [like me] you can fix that, same with the way you dress etc.) - has the biggest impact of all. Moral of the story - real data trumps everything, even if that data makes you realise you aren't entirely in control of the situation :)
mindcrime 16y ago
or just go learn how to pick up girls. the skills are relevant to entrepreneurs. In fact, the PUA guys have taken a lot of ideas from the exact same sources that are used by sales-people, marketers, etc. For example, Robert Cialdini's book Influence: The Psychology of Persuasion is a popular read amongst PUAs. You'll also see those guys recommending various books on sales and presentation skills, recommending improv classes (something else sales guys sometimes do), etc. So yeah, there's definitely a sort of connection there... :-)

buckwild 16y ago

you don't need to get rejected on purpose to overcome fear.

FrankBlack 16y ago

"This week, each one of you has a homework assignment. You're going to go out and start a fight with a total stranger... You're gonna start a fight...and you're gonna lose."

wwalker3 16y ago

Having to reject someone can be a very stressful experience. I don't like the idea of purposefully inflicting that stress on others unless there's a chance we both could benefit. "Getting rejected on purpose" sounds like I'd be picking situations where I know for sure I'll be rejected -- an inappropriate proposition, an undeserved request. I don't want to do that to someone else just to try to desensitize myself to rejection.

tlb 16y ago
Indeed, I shudder to imagine people following this advice and importuning others. The social contract among my peers seem to be to only ask for things that could be the start of a win-win negotiation.
- dschobel 16y ago
  The whole point of the exercise is that people underestimate what is possible in any given situation and misjudge their opportunities.

forensic 16y ago

"Rejection Therapy" is the inaccurate, possibly dangerous meme version of a real therapy - in vivo desensitization. Conquering fear is done by facing your fears not by intentionally going out with the expectation that things will go bad. Pessimism is just another defence mechanism from the true vulnerability of ambiguity. This meme is just psychologically wrong in so many ways. - Seeking rejection creates a self-fulfilling prophecy where you will be more likely to be rejected. - When you are rejected in this way, instead of processing it maturely, you're going to say "Oh it was part of my rejection therapy. I didn't really even want or expect to be accepted. Add one point to the scoreboard!." This is an attempt to dodge the reality of what happened - rejection is a negative thing. It's not the end of the world, but it also is probably not cause for celebration. You aren't fooling anyone (including yourself) by telling yourself it is positive. Anytime you are rejected from something you care about you are going to have sad feelings at the least. The way to handle these is to face them, own them, feel them, realize they will go away, and try again another day. But inflicting this on yourself on purpose is masochism and unhealthy. - For most people, experiencing a lot of rejection will not make them less fearful of rejection, it will make them more fearful. They will come to expect rejection more and then avoid behaviours that they believe will lead to it. - The effective, scientifically proven way to face your fears is to do it piece by piece, in small bites, and to recognize that if you are not allowing yourself to be truly emotionally vulnerable, you are not really facing your fear of rejection. The fear of rejection is about asking for something you want and then feeling the uncomfortable vulnerable feelings of ambiguity. It's about making yourself emotionally vulnerable - you genuinely want something and will be happy to receive it and sad to be denied it. This is true vulnerability. You cannot avoid the pain of rejection, you can only learn to process it when it happens, and to have the courage to risk that pain because you know it's all for a greater good. But inflicting this pain on yourself needlessly is masochistic and will likely lead to more phobias and anxiety, not less. Those who are having trouble with fear - look up systematic desensitization and in vivo desensitization. Also, remember that true courage means allowing yourself to be vulnerable. And vulnerability means allowing for the instance where you feel bad. A coward is someone who finds ways to avoid any chance of feeling bad. A courageous person is one who is willing to risk losing something he desires because he knows that it is a smart risk.

16y ago