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> a) it encourages car drivers to assume bicycles should not be in the lanes This is something I’m struggling with right now. The city where I live has a lot o

by pagnol 7y ago

> a) it encourages car drivers to assume bicycles should not be in the lanes This is something I’m struggling with right now. The city where I live has a lot of mediocre or downright dangerous lanes for cyclists which are often very narrow and next to a column of parked cars so that riders can get hit by a suddenly opened door. When I then ride on the road instead, I often have to contend with car drivers who seem seem to purposefully pass by very closely at high speeds, seemingly in an attempt to ‘teach me a lesson’ and get me to ride on the bicycle lane again. That’s my interpretation at least. Has anyone else here noticed something like this?

btrettel 7y ago
Yes, those are often called "punishment passes". I've even had drivers pass me dangerously closely when I was riding 17 mph in a 15 mph zone with sharrows printed in the lane. I stop and speak with some of these drivers at the stop light, so I'm not even breaking the law and they literally save zero time. Far too many of these drivers seem surprised that the speed limit is 15 mph as they seem to think they should drive 40 mph or faster.
- pagnol 7y ago
  Oh wow, so it’s actually a thing. What kinds of responses do you get from drivers when you talk to them afterwards? Thanks also for mentioning the term ‘punishment pass’, googling this led me to some interesting blog posts.
  - btrettel 7y ago
    You also might find the acronym MGIF (must get in front) to be interesting. I think it's mostly used by British cyclists. If my memory serves, the responses range wildly. On one end you have completely reasonable and sincere sounding apologies that they accidentally passed me dangerously. Whether or not these were accidents, I don't know. On the other end you have the typical rants against cyclists. In the middle I might help convince bad drivers to treat cyclists nicer. One time a driver I was speaking to seemed apologetic and some random pedestrian started screaming at me about how I shouldn't be telling drivers what to do. That guy was nuts.
    - colpabar 7y ago
      That's awesome you talk to them. I imagine most people yell or do something dangerous because they think they'll never have to face you afterwards.
    - pagnol 7y ago
      I didn’t know the MGIF acronym although the attitude is something I pretty much take for granted. If I’m on a narrow road with a car behind me, I mostly expect the driver will try to squeeze past me even though they won’t be significantly faster.
      - julianlam 7y ago
        Oof, that's where defensive cycling is important. Whenever I come up to a spot where a car and a bike cannot fit side by side (with safe clearance), I take the lane.
- kryogen1c 7y ago
  > I was riding 17 mph in a 15 mph zone Where in the world is there a 15mph zone where cars can drive 40 that bikes want to go? I cant think of a single 15 mph zone in any of the 6 cities ive lived
  - btrettel 7y ago
    San Jacinto Blvd. at the University of Texas at Austin campus. I would intentionally ride there on my commute because the speed limit is so low. To be fair, few drivers seem to actually go 40 mph, though 25-30 mph seems to be regularly observed, particularly on the downhill road next to it (Deloss Dodds Way). I could easily do 30 mph going downhill there. I think the speed limit is 15 in that entire area due to the heavy pedestrian traffic.
    - ummonk 7y ago
      Yeah, 40 mph there would be really unusual. Most cars drive at reasonable speeds there. Source: I lived in Creekside dorm.
u801e 7y ago
> When I then ride on the road instead, I often have to contend with car drivers who seem seem to purposefully pass by very closely at high speeds If you ride at the edge of the general purpose lane, then this is very likely to happen because drivers will believe their vehicle will fit between you and traffic in the adjacent lane. If you ride in the center (or between the center and left tire track) position in the lane, then practically all faster traffic will completely change lanes to pass you.
lrajlich 7y ago
this is a thing, happened to me today in fact on a neighborhood street.

by pagnol 7y ago

btrettel 7y ago

Yes, those are often called "punishment passes". I've even had drivers pass me dangerously closely when I was riding 17 mph in a 15 mph zone with sharrows printed in the lane. I stop and speak with some of these drivers at the stop light, so I'm not even breaking the law and they literally save zero time. Far too many of these drivers seem surprised that the speed limit is 15 mph as they seem to think they should drive 40 mph or faster.

pagnol 7y ago
Oh wow, so it’s actually a thing. What kinds of responses do you get from drivers when you talk to them afterwards? Thanks also for mentioning the term ‘punishment pass’, googling this led me to some interesting blog posts.
- btrettel 7y ago
  You also might find the acronym MGIF (must get in front) to be interesting. I think it's mostly used by British cyclists. If my memory serves, the responses range wildly. On one end you have completely reasonable and sincere sounding apologies that they accidentally passed me dangerously. Whether or not these were accidents, I don't know. On the other end you have the typical rants against cyclists. In the middle I might help convince bad drivers to treat cyclists nicer. One time a driver I was speaking to seemed apologetic and some random pedestrian started screaming at me about how I shouldn't be telling drivers what to do. That guy was nuts.
  - colpabar 7y ago
    That's awesome you talk to them. I imagine most people yell or do something dangerous because they think they'll never have to face you afterwards.
  - pagnol 7y ago
    I didn’t know the MGIF acronym although the attitude is something I pretty much take for granted. If I’m on a narrow road with a car behind me, I mostly expect the driver will try to squeeze past me even though they won’t be significantly faster.
    - julianlam 7y ago
      Oof, that's where defensive cycling is important. Whenever I come up to a spot where a car and a bike cannot fit side by side (with safe clearance), I take the lane.
kryogen1c 7y ago
> I was riding 17 mph in a 15 mph zone Where in the world is there a 15mph zone where cars can drive 40 that bikes want to go? I cant think of a single 15 mph zone in any of the 6 cities ive lived
- btrettel 7y ago
  San Jacinto Blvd. at the University of Texas at Austin campus. I would intentionally ride there on my commute because the speed limit is so low. To be fair, few drivers seem to actually go 40 mph, though 25-30 mph seems to be regularly observed, particularly on the downhill road next to it (Deloss Dodds Way). I could easily do 30 mph going downhill there. I think the speed limit is 15 in that entire area due to the heavy pedestrian traffic.
  - ummonk 7y ago
    Yeah, 40 mph there would be really unusual. Most cars drive at reasonable speeds there. Source: I lived in Creekside dorm.

u801e 7y ago

> When I then ride on the road instead, I often have to contend with car drivers who seem seem to purposefully pass by very closely at high speeds If you ride at the edge of the general purpose lane, then this is very likely to happen because drivers will believe their vehicle will fit between you and traffic in the adjacent lane. If you ride in the center (or between the center and left tire track) position in the lane, then practically all faster traffic will completely change lanes to pass you.

lrajlich 7y ago

this is a thing, happened to me today in fact on a neighborhood street.