6 ms·

Whale with harness could be Russian weapon, say Norwegian experts

66 points by Clepsydra 7y ago

Clepsydra 7y ago
The removal of the harness: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zYXOPZfuOow https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zYXOPZfuOow
- Chris_Chambers 7y ago
  That video does not show the removal of the harness.
  - CharlesColeman 7y ago
    > That video does not show the removal of the harness. This article includes that video and also pics of the removed harness. Apparently the buckle is marked with the brand "Equipment St. (logo) Petersburg." https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/27716/did-this-beluga-whale-escape-from-a-russian-navy-training-program https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/27716/did-this-beluga-...
brudgers 7y ago
Related, military dolphins, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_dolphin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_dolphin
shaki-dora 7y ago
This is the sort of totally obvious prisoner’s dilemma that just a tiny bit of international cooperation could easily avoid, if only Russia (and now the US) had not gone down the road of pseudo-macho brutalism in politics. With the beluga cat now out of the bag, any maritime conflict will be liable to justify the wholesale slaughter of large marine mammals, just as 60 years of preservation efforts have been showing some good results, and incidentally proving that international cooperation actually can work. On the plus side, nothing was gained. Whales as a weapons, or reconnaissance, platform may have worked as a tactical surprise. But it is useless once it’s known. Killing all the whales in the Atlantic is a day’s worth of fun for bored sailors. Instead, everyone could have just played солитер all day in the safe knowledge that they are doing the best work of their life.
grandinj 7y ago
Or it could be a loose piece of harness floating around the sea that the whale got trapped in. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zebra_(medicine) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zebra_(medicine)
- StavrosK 7y ago
  Then it got trapped in it pretty damn neatly, with one part behind the fun and one on its "neck". It's like my dog getting randomly tangled in its chest harness with the legs in the right position.
  - Deutschland 7y ago
    How many whale-sized harnesses are just floating around in the sea anyway?
    - 0_gravitas 7y ago
      If this was 10 years ago and not hackernews I'd be able to find a yo-mamma joke somewhere in here...
    - CharlesColeman 7y ago
      > How many whale-sized harnesses are just floating around in the sea anyway? Quite a lot actually. RT was just showing a documentary about the undersea harness plants of Sweden. Apparently they are naturally made of nylon and float up from from the sea floor and attach to Beluga wales to spread their seeds throughout the sea. Absolutely nothing to do with Russia. /s
- aaron695 7y ago
  More pics here https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/27716/did-this-beluga-whale-escape-from-a-russian-navy-training-program https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/27716/did-this-beluga-... I agree they are making stuff up (it doesn't say "Equipment of St. Petersburg" for instance as you can clearly see from the pic) But it's something.
lm28469 7y ago
Have you seen the harness ? [0] You might be able to strap a gps or a camera on it, but a weapon ?! What's up with all the articles "russia/china bad" popping up recently ? > In 1980s Soviet Russia, a programme saw dolphins recruited for military training Yeah, just like any nation with enough defence budget. Dolphins/sea lions [1], dogs, rats [2], &c. are used all the time. [0] https://www.sciencealert.com/mysterious-whale-wearing-strange-harness-suspected-of-being-russian-operative https://www.sciencealert.com/mysterious-whale-wearing-strang... [1] https://www.businessinsider.com/5-animals-that-serve-in-the-us-military-2015-7?IR=T https://www.businessinsider.com/5-animals-that-serve-in-the-... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/APOPO https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/APOPO
- _iyig 7y ago
  Well, Russia recently invaded a European country, assassinated several people in the U.K., got caught using spies to infiltrate U.S. political parties, hacked the emails of a U.S. presidential candidate while meeting secretly with her opponent (who may or may not be massively in the Russian government’s debt), and resumed air attack drills on NATO countries. So, a lot of English-speaking people see Russia as the “bad guy” right now.
  - basetop 7y ago
    I'd stopped consuming so much cable news, it can rot your brain. And why did you edit out "China's human rights may be even worse" from your comment? That's certainly something that is up for debate. "English-speaking people"? What's that? Russia does bad things. China does bad things. The EU does bad things. We do bad things. What's strange is the sudden hysteria and relentless propaganda directed towards china and russia in particular. It's not like Russia and China were saints before.
    - _iyig 7y ago
      >And why did you edit out "China's human rights may be even worse" from your comment? That's certainly something that is up for debate. That comment didn’t seem relevant in hindsight. The article is only about Russia. Discussion of China’s human rights record would not be on-topic commentary.
bayareanative 7y ago
Oh noes... not more Russiagate conspiracy theories. Chris Hedges and Aaron Mate were just on with an American RT host Rick Sanchez talking about the reasons for this sort of theme. I also think it feeds into rising nationalism that (inevitably?) lead to things like civil war and world wars. https://youtu.be/b1wlheHxuLY https://youtu.be/b1wlheHxuLY
- pavlov 7y ago
  Don't forget that Russia Today is part of a deliberate effort to feed that rising nationalism in Western countries. Undermining international collaboration is the foundation of Putin's long-term geopolitical game.
stunt 7y ago
Wikipedia page about trained animals for military: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_animal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_animal While there are some efforts to keep mammals away from wars specially when it comes to sea creatures. But sadly no one cares about dogs and horses that are being used and trained.
latchkey 7y ago
I used to scuba dive a lot in the kelp beds off of Point Loma, San Diego in the early 90's. One day while floating on the top of the water with my buddy after a dive, a military boat drives by really fast. All the sudden, I'm lifted and spun around by a huge push of water. Scared me silly, I will never forget it. After a moment, I realized it was a couple of trained dolphins following the boat and messing with me. My buddy couldn't stop laughing at me.
sealthedeal 7y ago
https://imgur.com/gallery/yOqWINO https://imgur.com/gallery/yOqWINO
mothsonasloth 7y ago
Video of Russian Navy Seals (source by RupTly) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-unYZ6ltfI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-unYZ6ltfI
Flourescent 7y ago
I thought the Russians were partial to giant squids
nwmcsween 7y ago
The comments here are getting border line conspiracy theory crazy, its honestly sad to see that people think the invasion of another country was justified (Ukraine) and 'mass media' lied about it all.

66 points by Clepsydra 7y ago

Clepsydra 7y ago

The removal of the harness: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zYXOPZfuOow https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zYXOPZfuOow

Chris_Chambers 7y ago
That video does not show the removal of the harness.
- CharlesColeman 7y ago
  > That video does not show the removal of the harness. This article includes that video and also pics of the removed harness. Apparently the buckle is marked with the brand "Equipment St. (logo) Petersburg." https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/27716/did-this-beluga-whale-escape-from-a-russian-navy-training-program https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/27716/did-this-beluga-...

brudgers 7y ago

Related, military dolphins, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_dolphin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_dolphin

shaki-dora 7y ago

This is the sort of totally obvious prisoner’s dilemma that just a tiny bit of international cooperation could easily avoid, if only Russia (and now the US) had not gone down the road of pseudo-macho brutalism in politics. With the beluga cat now out of the bag, any maritime conflict will be liable to justify the wholesale slaughter of large marine mammals, just as 60 years of preservation efforts have been showing some good results, and incidentally proving that international cooperation actually can work. On the plus side, nothing was gained. Whales as a weapons, or reconnaissance, platform may have worked as a tactical surprise. But it is useless once it’s known. Killing all the whales in the Atlantic is a day’s worth of fun for bored sailors. Instead, everyone could have just played солитер all day in the safe knowledge that they are doing the best work of their life.

grandinj 7y ago

Or it could be a loose piece of harness floating around the sea that the whale got trapped in. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zebra_(medicine) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zebra_(medicine)

StavrosK 7y ago
Then it got trapped in it pretty damn neatly, with one part behind the fun and one on its "neck". It's like my dog getting randomly tangled in its chest harness with the legs in the right position.
- Deutschland 7y ago
  How many whale-sized harnesses are just floating around in the sea anyway?
  - 0_gravitas 7y ago
    If this was 10 years ago and not hackernews I'd be able to find a yo-mamma joke somewhere in here...
  - CharlesColeman 7y ago
    > How many whale-sized harnesses are just floating around in the sea anyway? Quite a lot actually. RT was just showing a documentary about the undersea harness plants of Sweden. Apparently they are naturally made of nylon and float up from from the sea floor and attach to Beluga wales to spread their seeds throughout the sea. Absolutely nothing to do with Russia. /s
aaron695 7y ago
More pics here https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/27716/did-this-beluga-whale-escape-from-a-russian-navy-training-program https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/27716/did-this-beluga-... I agree they are making stuff up (it doesn't say "Equipment of St. Petersburg" for instance as you can clearly see from the pic) But it's something.

lm28469 7y ago

Have you seen the harness ? [0] You might be able to strap a gps or a camera on it, but a weapon ?! What's up with all the articles "russia/china bad" popping up recently ? > In 1980s Soviet Russia, a programme saw dolphins recruited for military training Yeah, just like any nation with enough defence budget. Dolphins/sea lions [1], dogs, rats [2], &c. are used all the time. [0] https://www.sciencealert.com/mysterious-whale-wearing-strange-harness-suspected-of-being-russian-operative https://www.sciencealert.com/mysterious-whale-wearing-strang... [1] https://www.businessinsider.com/5-animals-that-serve-in-the-us-military-2015-7?IR=T https://www.businessinsider.com/5-animals-that-serve-in-the-... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/APOPO https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/APOPO

_iyig 7y ago
Well, Russia recently invaded a European country, assassinated several people in the U.K., got caught using spies to infiltrate U.S. political parties, hacked the emails of a U.S. presidential candidate while meeting secretly with her opponent (who may or may not be massively in the Russian government’s debt), and resumed air attack drills on NATO countries. So, a lot of English-speaking people see Russia as the “bad guy” right now.
- basetop 7y ago
  I'd stopped consuming so much cable news, it can rot your brain. And why did you edit out "China's human rights may be even worse" from your comment? That's certainly something that is up for debate. "English-speaking people"? What's that? Russia does bad things. China does bad things. The EU does bad things. We do bad things. What's strange is the sudden hysteria and relentless propaganda directed towards china and russia in particular. It's not like Russia and China were saints before.
  - _iyig 7y ago
    >And why did you edit out "China's human rights may be even worse" from your comment? That's certainly something that is up for debate. That comment didn’t seem relevant in hindsight. The article is only about Russia. Discussion of China’s human rights record would not be on-topic commentary.

bayareanative 7y ago

Oh noes... not more Russiagate conspiracy theories. Chris Hedges and Aaron Mate were just on with an American RT host Rick Sanchez talking about the reasons for this sort of theme. I also think it feeds into rising nationalism that (inevitably?) lead to things like civil war and world wars. https://youtu.be/b1wlheHxuLY https://youtu.be/b1wlheHxuLY

pavlov 7y ago
Don't forget that Russia Today is part of a deliberate effort to feed that rising nationalism in Western countries. Undermining international collaboration is the foundation of Putin's long-term geopolitical game.

stunt 7y ago

Wikipedia page about trained animals for military: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_animal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_animal While there are some efforts to keep mammals away from wars specially when it comes to sea creatures. But sadly no one cares about dogs and horses that are being used and trained.

latchkey 7y ago

I used to scuba dive a lot in the kelp beds off of Point Loma, San Diego in the early 90's. One day while floating on the top of the water with my buddy after a dive, a military boat drives by really fast. All the sudden, I'm lifted and spun around by a huge push of water. Scared me silly, I will never forget it. After a moment, I realized it was a couple of trained dolphins following the boat and messing with me. My buddy couldn't stop laughing at me.

sealthedeal 7y ago

https://imgur.com/gallery/yOqWINO https://imgur.com/gallery/yOqWINO

mothsonasloth 7y ago

Video of Russian Navy Seals (source by RupTly) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-unYZ6ltfI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-unYZ6ltfI

Flourescent 7y ago

I thought the Russians were partial to giant squids

nwmcsween 7y ago

The comments here are getting border line conspiracy theory crazy, its honestly sad to see that people think the invasion of another country was justified (Ukraine) and 'mass media' lied about it all.