7 ms·

In the U.S. we have a lot of problems that are really socio-economic that are discussed in terms of race. There are historical reasons for this and this is par

by skh 8y ago

In the U.S. we have a lot of problems that are really socio-economic that are discussed in terms of race. There are historical reasons for this and this is particularly true in the southeastern part of the country. When white people talk about those taking handouts or getting something for free they mostly are talking about poor brown people. This despite the fact that whites - due to being a majority of th population - consume a majority of the welfare. If I talk about poor people in a large city almost everyone will imagine a black person. There is the perception broadly speaking that white = wealthy and black = poor. Blacks on average are poorer and are more likely to be charged with committing a crime but in terms of numbers most crimes are committed by whites and most poor people are white. In the 90s when Hilary Clinton talked about super predators the images were those of black criminals. When Reagan talked about welfare queens the image given was of a black woman with lots of kids. I’ve felt that if poor whites in the U.S. stopped thinking of themselves as better than brown people, if they would stop believing the myths and media narratives about race then we’d have universal health care and free higher education. A former President from Texas once said If you can convince the lowest white man that he’s better than the best colored man, he won’t notice you’re picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he’ll even empty his pockets for you.

weberc2 8y ago
> When white people talk about those taking handouts or getting something for free they mostly are talking about poor brown people. This is not my experience as a lifelong American with many white friends, family, etc. > Blacks on average are poorer and are more likely to be charged with committing a crime but in terms of numbers most crimes are committed by whites and most poor people are white. Of course, whites are a larger part of the population—60ish percent in the USA, but they undercommit crimes. For whatever reason (legacy of historical racism, poor socioeconomic status, etc), black Americans overcommit crimes both according to police data and victim reports. Many are tempted to deny these facts as “supportive of racism”, but these facts don’t support racism because the variance within a race is huge and the overwhelming majority of any race are decent, productive, law-abiding people. > I’ve felt that if poor whites in the U.S. stopped thinking of themselves as better than brown people, if they would stop believing the myths and media narratives about race then we’d have universal health care and free higher education. In America, the media narratives about race are entirely sympathetic toward minorities. I would also appreciate a citation for the implication that poor white Americans are somehow more racist than other Americans (esp other poor Americans).
- dwater 8y ago
  > In America, the media narratives about race are entirely sympathetic toward minorities. I would also appreciate a citation for the implication that poor white Americans are somehow more racist than other Americans (esp other poor Americans). That may be starting to shift, but it is not true that American media is more sympathetic towards minorities. "White Americans overestimate the proportion of crime committed by people of color, and associate people of color with criminality." "Many media outlets reinforce the public’s racial misconceptions about crime by presenting African Americans and Latinos differently than whites – both quantitatively and qualitatively. Television news programs and newspapers over-represent racial minorities as crime suspects and whites as crime victims. Black and Latino suspects are also more likely than whites to be presented in a non-individualized and threatening way – unnamed and in police custody." "Race and Punishment: Racial Perceptions of Crime and Support for Punitive Policies" https://www.sentencingproject.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/Race-and-Punishment.pdf https://www.sentencingproject.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/11...
  - weberc2 8y ago
    > That may be starting to shift, but it is not true that American media is more sympathetic towards minorities. This is a puzzling claim, especially just a few weeks after the Covington incident.
    - skh 8y ago
      You can cite anecdotes and the person you responded to cited a study. The puzzling thing is that you choose to focus on the former and not the latter. You have been presented evidence that your perception is not correct. Perhaps study the issue further to see if indeed your perception is incorrect.
      - seatdrummer 8y ago
        As an aside, at what point do we stop an interesting discussion due to a limit of studies or data. If something hasn't been measured, or hasn't been measured since 2016, can we really just give in. If the question is about media being sympathetic, in recent years, toward the oppression that every black person in the u.s. experiences every day. Does data from the 90s really trump no data at all? Isn't the question about recent times for which nobody might have evidence for ordering either case. And if there is no study, can a sound and valid argument still be made.

by skh 8y ago

weberc2 8y ago

> When white people talk about those taking handouts or getting something for free they mostly are talking about poor brown people. This is not my experience as a lifelong American with many white friends, family, etc. > Blacks on average are poorer and are more likely to be charged with committing a crime but in terms of numbers most crimes are committed by whites and most poor people are white. Of course, whites are a larger part of the population—60ish percent in the USA, but they undercommit crimes. For whatever reason (legacy of historical racism, poor socioeconomic status, etc), black Americans overcommit crimes both according to police data and victim reports. Many are tempted to deny these facts as “supportive of racism”, but these facts don’t support racism because the variance within a race is huge and the overwhelming majority of any race are decent, productive, law-abiding people. > I’ve felt that if poor whites in the U.S. stopped thinking of themselves as better than brown people, if they would stop believing the myths and media narratives about race then we’d have universal health care and free higher education. In America, the media narratives about race are entirely sympathetic toward minorities. I would also appreciate a citation for the implication that poor white Americans are somehow more racist than other Americans (esp other poor Americans).

dwater 8y ago
> In America, the media narratives about race are entirely sympathetic toward minorities. I would also appreciate a citation for the implication that poor white Americans are somehow more racist than other Americans (esp other poor Americans). That may be starting to shift, but it is not true that American media is more sympathetic towards minorities. "White Americans overestimate the proportion of crime committed by people of color, and associate people of color with criminality." "Many media outlets reinforce the public’s racial misconceptions about crime by presenting African Americans and Latinos differently than whites – both quantitatively and qualitatively. Television news programs and newspapers over-represent racial minorities as crime suspects and whites as crime victims. Black and Latino suspects are also more likely than whites to be presented in a non-individualized and threatening way – unnamed and in police custody." "Race and Punishment: Racial Perceptions of Crime and Support for Punitive Policies" https://www.sentencingproject.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/Race-and-Punishment.pdf https://www.sentencingproject.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/11...
- weberc2 8y ago
  > That may be starting to shift, but it is not true that American media is more sympathetic towards minorities. This is a puzzling claim, especially just a few weeks after the Covington incident.
  - skh 8y ago
    You can cite anecdotes and the person you responded to cited a study. The puzzling thing is that you choose to focus on the former and not the latter. You have been presented evidence that your perception is not correct. Perhaps study the issue further to see if indeed your perception is incorrect.
    - seatdrummer 8y ago
      As an aside, at what point do we stop an interesting discussion due to a limit of studies or data. If something hasn't been measured, or hasn't been measured since 2016, can we really just give in. If the question is about media being sympathetic, in recent years, toward the oppression that every black person in the u.s. experiences every day. Does data from the 90s really trump no data at all? Isn't the question about recent times for which nobody might have evidence for ordering either case. And if there is no study, can a sound and valid argument still be made.