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Protonmail is certainly one of the more secure mail solutions since it's e2e encrypted not just at rest. On the other hand it doesn't support U2F yet which does

Protonmail is certainly one of the more secure mail solutions since it's e2e encrypted not just at rest. On the other hand it doesn't support U2F yet which doesn't bring it to the top in terms of security. Regarding privacy I would say it's one of the best available solutions since everything is encrypted they can and do not read your email content.

drdaeman 9y ago
It's still a webapp, fully served from network, without any code signing (not even SRI to match hashes against), except for the TLS layer. AFAIK they don't even have a standalone variant except for the unofficial desktop Electron app, and a beta IMAP bridge for paying customers. Basically, they still ultimately rely on trust, just like others. While they're drastically different from e.g. Gmail, trust requirement is still there. If one's well-being really depends on security, it's best to err on side of caution. Meaning, something like MailPile on the client side, very cautious non-automated key exchange, and, optionally, self-hosted email with at-rest encryption (e.g. Postfix+Dovecot+GnuPG pipe) is probably much better option than anything Protonmail can offer in their current state. Or avoiding email (as it's not yet there and probably never will be) and using something like Wire or BitMessage or whatever (I'm not a security expert) has both client-side static and auditable source code and limits metadata leakage.
- binaryanomaly 9y ago
  Bridge is out of beta: https://protonmail.com/bridge/ https://protonmail.com/bridge/ and yes for paying customers. Given they don't sell your data it's natural that advanced features have a price. Yes there is of course trust involved as with anything. Still, for the majority of the folks it's better to trust someone else with their mail over running their own servers with gaping security holes. Avoiding email is not really possible yet and in the very near future...
  - JetSpiegel 9y ago
    > advanced features It's an email service. IMAP is a standard, not some feature they are charitably implementing.
    - aceofduh 9y ago
      There’s no competition for paid email. They can literally do whatever they want.
  - xfer 9y ago
    No linux client and closed source. I would love to switch my gsuite account but there is no real benefit.
    - binaryanomaly 9y ago
      Coming soon. Well the end it's only email. You decide whom to trust with. Personally, I feel better with Protonmail. It's not better nor cheaper than gsuite it just has a totally different proposition as a product.
badrabbit 9y ago
Why does it need to support u2f? Would be nice if it did but from a security point of view,it does support two factor authentication(TOTP). If you're concerned about the authenticator app being compromised then a dedicated phone or hardware token device can be configured. As I said,u2f has better security but at least financially speaking,time based OTP has a lower barrier of entry while being superior in it's security to most non-u2f alternates (phone call,sms,etc...). I don't think lack of u2f alone disqualifies it from being considered as having top tier authentication.
- pfg 9y ago
  U2F is the only generally available two-factor method that is phishing-resistant. Phishing accounts for a large percentage of targeted attacks, something that is highly relevant in a threat model for journalists.

drdaeman 9y ago

It's still a webapp, fully served from network, without any code signing (not even SRI to match hashes against), except for the TLS layer. AFAIK they don't even have a standalone variant except for the unofficial desktop Electron app, and a beta IMAP bridge for paying customers. Basically, they still ultimately rely on trust, just like others. While they're drastically different from e.g. Gmail, trust requirement is still there. If one's well-being really depends on security, it's best to err on side of caution. Meaning, something like MailPile on the client side, very cautious non-automated key exchange, and, optionally, self-hosted email with at-rest encryption (e.g. Postfix+Dovecot+GnuPG pipe) is probably much better option than anything Protonmail can offer in their current state. Or avoiding email (as it's not yet there and probably never will be) and using something like Wire or BitMessage or whatever (I'm not a security expert) has both client-side static and auditable source code and limits metadata leakage.

binaryanomaly 9y ago
Bridge is out of beta: https://protonmail.com/bridge/ https://protonmail.com/bridge/ and yes for paying customers. Given they don't sell your data it's natural that advanced features have a price. Yes there is of course trust involved as with anything. Still, for the majority of the folks it's better to trust someone else with their mail over running their own servers with gaping security holes. Avoiding email is not really possible yet and in the very near future...
- JetSpiegel 9y ago
  > advanced features It's an email service. IMAP is a standard, not some feature they are charitably implementing.
  - aceofduh 9y ago
    There’s no competition for paid email. They can literally do whatever they want.
- xfer 9y ago
  No linux client and closed source. I would love to switch my gsuite account but there is no real benefit.
  - binaryanomaly 9y ago
    Coming soon. Well the end it's only email. You decide whom to trust with. Personally, I feel better with Protonmail. It's not better nor cheaper than gsuite it just has a totally different proposition as a product.

badrabbit 9y ago

Why does it need to support u2f? Would be nice if it did but from a security point of view,it does support two factor authentication(TOTP). If you're concerned about the authenticator app being compromised then a dedicated phone or hardware token device can be configured. As I said,u2f has better security but at least financially speaking,time based OTP has a lower barrier of entry while being superior in it's security to most non-u2f alternates (phone call,sms,etc...). I don't think lack of u2f alone disqualifies it from being considered as having top tier authentication.

pfg 9y ago
U2F is the only generally available two-factor method that is phishing-resistant. Phishing accounts for a large percentage of targeted attacks, something that is highly relevant in a threat model for journalists.