5 ms·

The sick part is Amazon is asking cities to fight over the privilege to kiss it's ass. So the bidding goes higher and higher as the people get robbed more and m

The sick part is Amazon is asking cities to fight over the privilege to kiss it's ass. So the bidding goes higher and higher as the people get robbed more and more.

Roritharr 9y ago
Just wait until the tax incentives run out and they simply move again. Nokia did this in Germany, it was quite the joyride.
- jrs235 9y ago
  And I bet when/if Wisconsin stops kissing Foxconn's butt, Foxconn will threaten to move. And if threatening fails then they'll move. The Wisconsin/Foxconn deal is a horrible deal for Wisconsin.
  - bilbo0s 9y ago
    The Foxconn deal is interesting for a number of reasons. First, it's huge, and in a state that arguably does not have the population or state budget to support the subsidies. ie - Whether or not Wisconsin can actually afford this is an open question. Secondly, just as you mentioned, if Foxconn does start up in Wisconsin, and they eat up all of the subsidies... what is to stop them from moving? Lastly, the Foxconn deal is a very 20th century attempt at growth in what a lot of smart people claim is a new 21st century reality. One thought experiment put forth recently noted that there are roughly 3 or 4000 STEAM and business school graduates from Wisconsin universities every year. A 21st century attempt at growth might be to dole out seed level startup grants for those graduates with good enough ideas... something in the ... say ... 20000USD range. With the money they will give to Foxconn... They could do that for EVERY STEAM or business graduate, for EVERY year... for the next 50 or so years. It's hard to imagine that they wouldn't hit a high enough valuation on their portfolio to make their money back. I thought that was kind of a good point. So, I'd be very curious to see some states try the "state run ycombinator" thing, while others try the old give lots of subsidies to big companies thing... and see which model is more successful long term? We'll likely never see that... but it would be interesting from a purely academic perspective.
    - mistermann 9y ago
      Are you considering taxes on Foxconn workers salaries in your calculation?
      - bilbo0s 9y ago
        We could do that, if we could get an idea of the number of years that Foxconn is likely to continue doing business in Wisconsin. I'd imagine no one really knows that right now. So if we have a 50 year "y combinator" type fund, it might be a little unfair to compare the money generated from the companies started through that fund to the money generated by Foxconn if Foxconn only stays in Wisconsin for... say... 10 years. We just have no good data on that. How long will they stay? My COMPLETELY UNEDUCATED guess would be more than 5 years, but likely much less than 50 years. We could compare the income taxes generated, but my gut tells me that doing so would put the young STEM and business types even further ahead in terms of ROI. That's just a guess though.
    - fjsolwmv 9y ago
      STEM is relevant to economy development, not STEAM.
      - bilbo0s 9y ago
        I don't have data regarding the number of STEM grads though. The only thing I know is that there are roughly 3 or 4000 STEAM and Business school graduates. So that's what I have to go with. Besides, there are obviously LESS than 3 or 4000 STEM grads, so the program would last LONGER than 50 years in that case. (Although I think cross functional STEAM/Business teams are a better bet anyway... but even if you believe the STEM guys are capable of going it alone... it only makes the guy's argument more strong. Because the funding would last decades longer.)
      - hbosch 9y ago
        Economy and culture must grow together for healthy society to develop and thrive. The "A" is crucial in that respect. My opinion.

The sick part is Amazon is asking cities to fight over the privilege to kiss it's ass. So the bidding goes higher and higher as the people get robbed more and more.

Roritharr 9y ago

Just wait until the tax incentives run out and they simply move again. Nokia did this in Germany, it was quite the joyride.

jrs235 9y ago
And I bet when/if Wisconsin stops kissing Foxconn's butt, Foxconn will threaten to move. And if threatening fails then they'll move. The Wisconsin/Foxconn deal is a horrible deal for Wisconsin.
- bilbo0s 9y ago
  The Foxconn deal is interesting for a number of reasons. First, it's huge, and in a state that arguably does not have the population or state budget to support the subsidies. ie - Whether or not Wisconsin can actually afford this is an open question. Secondly, just as you mentioned, if Foxconn does start up in Wisconsin, and they eat up all of the subsidies... what is to stop them from moving? Lastly, the Foxconn deal is a very 20th century attempt at growth in what a lot of smart people claim is a new 21st century reality. One thought experiment put forth recently noted that there are roughly 3 or 4000 STEAM and business school graduates from Wisconsin universities every year. A 21st century attempt at growth might be to dole out seed level startup grants for those graduates with good enough ideas... something in the ... say ... 20000USD range. With the money they will give to Foxconn... They could do that for EVERY STEAM or business graduate, for EVERY year... for the next 50 or so years. It's hard to imagine that they wouldn't hit a high enough valuation on their portfolio to make their money back. I thought that was kind of a good point. So, I'd be very curious to see some states try the "state run ycombinator" thing, while others try the old give lots of subsidies to big companies thing... and see which model is more successful long term? We'll likely never see that... but it would be interesting from a purely academic perspective.
  - mistermann 9y ago
    Are you considering taxes on Foxconn workers salaries in your calculation?
    - bilbo0s 9y ago
      We could do that, if we could get an idea of the number of years that Foxconn is likely to continue doing business in Wisconsin. I'd imagine no one really knows that right now. So if we have a 50 year "y combinator" type fund, it might be a little unfair to compare the money generated from the companies started through that fund to the money generated by Foxconn if Foxconn only stays in Wisconsin for... say... 10 years. We just have no good data on that. How long will they stay? My COMPLETELY UNEDUCATED guess would be more than 5 years, but likely much less than 50 years. We could compare the income taxes generated, but my gut tells me that doing so would put the young STEM and business types even further ahead in terms of ROI. That's just a guess though.
  - fjsolwmv 9y ago
    STEM is relevant to economy development, not STEAM.
    - bilbo0s 9y ago
      I don't have data regarding the number of STEM grads though. The only thing I know is that there are roughly 3 or 4000 STEAM and Business school graduates. So that's what I have to go with. Besides, there are obviously LESS than 3 or 4000 STEM grads, so the program would last LONGER than 50 years in that case. (Although I think cross functional STEAM/Business teams are a better bet anyway... but even if you believe the STEM guys are capable of going it alone... it only makes the guy's argument more strong. Because the funding would last decades longer.)
    - hbosch 9y ago
      Economy and culture must grow together for healthy society to develop and thrive. The "A" is crucial in that respect. My opinion.