4 ms·

I'm from the midwest and most people who weren't aiming for Ivy Leagues just took the ACT.

jblumstein 9y ago
Yah. It's weird that de Boer argues selection bias is in play in SAT participation between MS (3%) and CT (88%) when 100% of MS high schoolers take the ACT. That seems to be what's happening here: the kids in MS taking the SAT in addition to the ACT are the ones aiming for elite schools.
- boomboomsubban 9y ago
  >the kids in MS taking the SAT in addition to the ACT are the ones aiming for elite schools Which is an extreme selection bias. The ACT should have been mentioned to provide more context, but the actual argument works without it.
  - jblumstein 9y ago
    You say it better than I do. Agreed it's an extreme selection bias, just want to point out that it's slightly different than the one de Boer seemed to be pointing out.
    - boomboomsubban 9y ago
      It's still the same bias he argues, the three percent are the most motivated and prepared. Why the other 97% skip it isn't relevant in this argument, but the number is independently shocking without the context. I fell for it until the ND mention, and I took the ACT.
- aetherson 9y ago
  That's... exactly what he said.
  - WillPostForFood 9y ago
    Yes, but without mentioning the ACT.
    - mercutio2 9y ago
      You seem to be taking issue with the fact that the piece could be interpreted as implying 97% of MS students didn’t want to go to college. Obviously, if that was his point, he was omitting the most important detail. His point was that if you bias the data source, you get results that you shouldn’t project onto the general population. The specific explanation of the 97% disinterest in the SAT is well and truly irrelevant.
      - WillPostForFood 9y ago
        My issue was more the opposite. If the author is saying, hey, only 3% of kids take the SAT which creates selection bias, most people will immediately wonder why the low percentage. The ACT info adds support and explanation to his own argument, so it should have been included.
cpete 9y ago
Same here. I didn't even know it was an option (obviously didn't go to an Ivy League university)...
scottLobster 9y ago
I'm from the East Coast and I took both, submitted both on college applications (I actually did slightly better on the ACT, not sure if it helped) but yeah SAT was given priority in school/training programs. I had to seek out the ACT.
mercutio2 9y ago
I’m from the Midwest and went to a majority black public high school. In all seriousness, I had never even heard of the ACT until college. The SAT and AP exams were the only tests ever discussed with us. I suspect there may be more variation in this than geography.

Yah. It's weird that de Boer argues selection bias is in play in SAT participation between MS (3%) and CT (88%) when 100% of MS high schoolers take the ACT. That seems to be what's happening here: the kids in MS taking the SAT in addition to the ACT are the ones aiming for elite schools.

boomboomsubban 9y ago
>the kids in MS taking the SAT in addition to the ACT are the ones aiming for elite schools Which is an extreme selection bias. The ACT should have been mentioned to provide more context, but the actual argument works without it.
- jblumstein 9y ago
  You say it better than I do. Agreed it's an extreme selection bias, just want to point out that it's slightly different than the one de Boer seemed to be pointing out.
  - boomboomsubban 9y ago
    It's still the same bias he argues, the three percent are the most motivated and prepared. Why the other 97% skip it isn't relevant in this argument, but the number is independently shocking without the context. I fell for it until the ND mention, and I took the ACT.
aetherson 9y ago
That's... exactly what he said.
- WillPostForFood 9y ago
  Yes, but without mentioning the ACT.
  - mercutio2 9y ago
    You seem to be taking issue with the fact that the piece could be interpreted as implying 97% of MS students didn’t want to go to college. Obviously, if that was his point, he was omitting the most important detail. His point was that if you bias the data source, you get results that you shouldn’t project onto the general population. The specific explanation of the 97% disinterest in the SAT is well and truly irrelevant.
    - WillPostForFood 9y ago
      My issue was more the opposite. If the author is saying, hey, only 3% of kids take the SAT which creates selection bias, most people will immediately wonder why the low percentage. The ACT info adds support and explanation to his own argument, so it should have been included.

cpete 9y ago

Same here. I didn't even know it was an option (obviously didn't go to an Ivy League university)...

scottLobster 9y ago

I'm from the East Coast and I took both, submitted both on college applications (I actually did slightly better on the ACT, not sure if it helped) but yeah SAT was given priority in school/training programs. I had to seek out the ACT.

mercutio2 9y ago

I’m from the Midwest and went to a majority black public high school. In all seriousness, I had never even heard of the ACT until college. The SAT and AP exams were the only tests ever discussed with us. I suspect there may be more variation in this than geography.