4 ms·

OpenBSD, FreeBSD, and NetBSD all have support for the older Apple G4 and G5 hardware. Obviously being older they are kind of slow (especially compared to amd64)

OpenBSD, FreeBSD, and NetBSD all have support for the older Apple G4 and G5 hardware. Obviously being older they are kind of slow (especially compared to amd64) but if you just use them as file servers they are fine. The biggest problem with BSD on PowerPC, in my opinion, is the lack of modern programming languages. I believe on BSD you are stuck with C, C++, ruby, python, and perl mostly. No node, no Java, no golang, no rust. If you use Debian you have access to Java.

rufius 10y ago
Keep in mind Power != PowerPC. Related families but there are differences (exercise left to the reader).
binarycrusader 10y ago
While Go doesn't have a port to BSD on POWER, there is a Go port for POWER on Linux (it's the s390x port). I imagine it shouldn't be too difficult (relatively speaking) to do the port as a result.
- StillBored 10y ago
  s390!=POWER The GOARCH for power is ppc64/ppc64le AFAIK. (s390x is the mainframe processor, aka z/Architecture, the latest being the z13 which is most definitely not a power8/9.)
  - binarycrusader 10y ago
    I had thought s390x could be based on POWER8/9, but you're right, that doesn't appear to be the case. I apologise. Regardless, Go does consider S390x to be a separate port.
    - jacques_chester 10y ago
      As I understand it, the s390x ISA is fully backwards compatible to stone tablets. But it's essentially a POWER chip with a bit of extra decoder logic.
      - wmf 10y ago
        There's actually very little in common between z/Arch and Power, but I don't blame you since "everybody knows" they are the same thing.
        StillBored 10y ago
        Yah, most of the descriptions (just a little extra decode, aka PowerPC AS), and sharing the hardware actually apply to the iSeries, which _IS_ POWER based. But of course that is a minicomputer not a maninframe... It seems the vast majority of people who consider themselves knowledgeable about computers are just massively ignorant/confused by IBM's product lines and capabilities (and don't even get me started about the nonstop and openvms). Which is a bit of a shame, particularly in the case of IBM i, which is probably one of the most interesting OS's still in support/production.
        jacques_chester 10y ago
        Today I learned. Thanks.
- slrz 10y ago
  S390x (IBM System z) is an arch distinct from POWER. They both have Go ports, though. edit: failed to refresh
- justincormack 10y ago
  The Go port is ppc64le, the new ABI (elf v2) which is Linux only at present, the BSDs support the elf v1 ppc ABI, which is a bit different and would need a different port, although it is mainly endianness and how function pointers work. As others have said s390x is nothing to do with Power.
kbenson 10y ago
What? Why wouldn't you have access to node? Source is available for those, and node even specifically addresses the BSDs[1]. I heard go does something kind of odd with system calls, so I could see if possibly having a problem (but I really don't know enough to state definitively). I'm not sure if rust targets that platform/arch combo, but I could see it being deferred while they focus on more common ones. Edit: It just occurred to me that Node's (V8's) optimized JIT probably uses ASM or at least routines optimized for x86, so that would complicate deployment. 1: https://nodejs.org/en/download/package-manager/#freebsd-and-openbsd https://nodejs.org/en/download/package-manager/#freebsd-and-...
- TD-Linux 10y ago
  Yeah, v8 is pretty famous for its lack of interpreter, though it looks like IBM is working on a port. You could also use the Chakra or SpiderMonkey ports.
- steveklabnik 10y ago
  > I'm not sure if rust targets that platform/arch combo It's the PPC bit that's tough at the moment, we do provide tier 2 support for {free,net}BSD on x86_64.
  - kbenson 10y ago
    I figured. Although this isn't PowerPC, but Power, and what little I was able to find quickly seems to indicate the instruction set has evolved since it was branched for PowerPC. I imagine even if PowerPC targeted binaries work on Power, they wouldn't use the platform to the fullest.
    - steveklabnik 10y ago
      Oh yeah, right. Point is, yeah, not yet. I wonder what LLVM's support of these arches is.
      - gsnedders 10y ago
iso-8859-1 10y ago
What about gccgo? "Gccgo, however, supports all the processors that GCC supports" Source: https://blog.golang.org/gccgo-in-gcc-471 https://blog.golang.org/gccgo-in-gcc-471
- justincormack 10y ago
  Many programs dont work with gccgo though.
ams6110 10y ago
Well, if you have C, you can get to pretty much anything else (maybe with some porting effort). I definitely built and ran Erlang on a G4 powerbook several years back.
lenoil98 10y ago
Java is now available for BSD on powerpc64. A set of patches were developed to add ppc64 support and have been officially committed to the bsd-port of openjdk8. Node also supports powerpc. Support was added courtesy the team at IBM. I have both working on my PowerMac G5, running FreeBSD 10.2.

rufius 10y ago

Keep in mind Power != PowerPC. Related families but there are differences (exercise left to the reader).

binarycrusader 10y ago

While Go doesn't have a port to BSD on POWER, there is a Go port for POWER on Linux (it's the s390x port). I imagine it shouldn't be too difficult (relatively speaking) to do the port as a result.

StillBored 10y ago
s390!=POWER The GOARCH for power is ppc64/ppc64le AFAIK. (s390x is the mainframe processor, aka z/Architecture, the latest being the z13 which is most definitely not a power8/9.)
- binarycrusader 10y ago
  I had thought s390x could be based on POWER8/9, but you're right, that doesn't appear to be the case. I apologise. Regardless, Go does consider S390x to be a separate port.
  - jacques_chester 10y ago
    As I understand it, the s390x ISA is fully backwards compatible to stone tablets. But it's essentially a POWER chip with a bit of extra decoder logic.
    - wmf 10y ago
      There's actually very little in common between z/Arch and Power, but I don't blame you since "everybody knows" they are the same thing.
      - StillBored 10y ago
        Yah, most of the descriptions (just a little extra decode, aka PowerPC AS), and sharing the hardware actually apply to the iSeries, which _IS_ POWER based. But of course that is a minicomputer not a maninframe... It seems the vast majority of people who consider themselves knowledgeable about computers are just massively ignorant/confused by IBM's product lines and capabilities (and don't even get me started about the nonstop and openvms). Which is a bit of a shame, particularly in the case of IBM i, which is probably one of the most interesting OS's still in support/production.
      - jacques_chester 10y ago
        Today I learned. Thanks.
slrz 10y ago
S390x (IBM System z) is an arch distinct from POWER. They both have Go ports, though. edit: failed to refresh
justincormack 10y ago
The Go port is ppc64le, the new ABI (elf v2) which is Linux only at present, the BSDs support the elf v1 ppc ABI, which is a bit different and would need a different port, although it is mainly endianness and how function pointers work. As others have said s390x is nothing to do with Power.

kbenson 10y ago

What? Why wouldn't you have access to node? Source is available for those, and node even specifically addresses the BSDs[1]. I heard go does something kind of odd with system calls, so I could see if possibly having a problem (but I really don't know enough to state definitively). I'm not sure if rust targets that platform/arch combo, but I could see it being deferred while they focus on more common ones. Edit: It just occurred to me that Node's (V8's) optimized JIT probably uses ASM or at least routines optimized for x86, so that would complicate deployment. 1: https://nodejs.org/en/download/package-manager/#freebsd-and-openbsd https://nodejs.org/en/download/package-manager/#freebsd-and-...

TD-Linux 10y ago
Yeah, v8 is pretty famous for its lack of interpreter, though it looks like IBM is working on a port. You could also use the Chakra or SpiderMonkey ports.
steveklabnik 10y ago
> I'm not sure if rust targets that platform/arch combo It's the PPC bit that's tough at the moment, we do provide tier 2 support for {free,net}BSD on x86_64.
- kbenson 10y ago
  I figured. Although this isn't PowerPC, but Power, and what little I was able to find quickly seems to indicate the instruction set has evolved since it was branched for PowerPC. I imagine even if PowerPC targeted binaries work on Power, they wouldn't use the platform to the fullest.
  - steveklabnik 10y ago
    Oh yeah, right. Point is, yeah, not yet. I wonder what LLVM's support of these arches is.
    - gsnedders 10y ago

iso-8859-1 10y ago

What about gccgo? "Gccgo, however, supports all the processors that GCC supports" Source: https://blog.golang.org/gccgo-in-gcc-471 https://blog.golang.org/gccgo-in-gcc-471

justincormack 10y ago
Many programs dont work with gccgo though.

ams6110 10y ago

Well, if you have C, you can get to pretty much anything else (maybe with some porting effort). I definitely built and ran Erlang on a G4 powerbook several years back.

lenoil98 10y ago

Java is now available for BSD on powerpc64. A set of patches were developed to add ppc64 support and have been officially committed to the bsd-port of openjdk8. Node also supports powerpc. Support was added courtesy the team at IBM. I have both working on my PowerMac G5, running FreeBSD 10.2.