13 ms·

I've also lived in Atlanta a long time, but have also lived in other places for longer. If you think Atlanta is a bastion of segregation, it would benefit you t

by jcizzle 11y ago

I've also lived in Atlanta a long time, but have also lived in other places for longer. If you think Atlanta is a bastion of segregation, it would benefit you to widen your perspective. But as they say, if you are looking for something, you'll eventually find it - even if it doesn't exist. By the way, the neighborhoods are so 'cheap' because poor people lived there for a long time. (I put cheap in quotes, because homes in this neighborhood are significantly more expensive than the average home in America.) The homes require more work and the school systems have less resources. If you want to walk back in history and find out why poor people live in this neighborhood, great, understanding history is important so that its negative aspects don't repeat itself. But what are you suggesting, that the neighborhood stays poor? Or it stays segregated? If anything, the raising prices of homes in neighborhoods like these indicates that people no longer care about their neighbor's skin color. That's a good thing.

rayiner 11y ago
The legacy of segregation in Atlanta isn't something you have to look for--you'd have to be blind not to see it: http://socialshutter.blogspot.com/2012/10/when-street-names-change-on-other-side.html http://socialshutter.blogspot.com/2012/10/when-street-names-.... > By the way, the neighborhoods are so 'cheap' because poor people lived there for a long time. (I put cheap in quotes, because homes in this neighborhood are significantly more expensive than the average home in America.) The homes require more work and the school systems have less resources. Gee, why do you think all that is?
- jcizzle 11y ago
  You know those streets changed names 80 years ago, right? Monroe/Boulevard split in 1932, for example. You also know that every American knows about the civil rights era, too? They teach us that in school. You can keep pointing back to history and saying 'Hey, it was unfair!' and I doubt anyone is going to disagree with you. My point is that things are changing for the better, whether you want to look forward or behind is up to you.
  - rayiner 11y ago
    If I bend a paperclip, it's going to stay bent. Until someone unbends it, it's state will be attributable to my bending it, no matter how long ago that happened. I'm not saying "those neighborhoods were poor 50 years ago because they were segregated, that's so unfair!" I'm saying "those neighborhoods are still poor because they were segregated 50 years ago, and nobody has undone the effects of segregation and put those people back in the position they would have been but for segregation."
    - yummyfajitas 11y ago
      You used this exact analogy 8 months ago and it's fallaciousness was demonstrated (Asians/Jews/Irish all "unbent" themselves, as did many immigrant groups from < 50 years ago, e.g. Indians and Vietnamese boat people). Why repeat an argument you know to be flawed? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9942354 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9942354
      - tptacek 11y ago
        You are going well past your trademark contrarianism and into something creepier here.
    - dcole2929 11y ago
      yummyfajitas there is a stark difference between the experiences of the groups you mentioned in America and the 200+ years of slavery, followed by 100 years of segregation and discrimination, followed by 50+ years of racial profiling and predatory policy that blacks in America have gone through. I don't for a second doubt the hardships of other races and many have pulled themselves up from where they began here, but you can't honestly compare the two experiences and find anything more than surface level similarities.
      - yummyfajitas 11y ago
        According to Rayiner, a paperclip won't unbend itself. Now, maybe sometimes it will, other times it won't if it's been subjected to the right historical stimulus. I'm also not really sure how you can suggest the historical hardships that Korean Americans faced weren't a lot worse than black Americans. Korea was dirt poor (think worst part of Africa levels) since forever, then a war, then refugees into the racist US. Post WW2 Filipinos and post-Vietnam war Vietnamese have a very similar story. So tell me; why again is Rayiners "nothing ever unbends itself" story remotely plausible?

by jcizzle 11y ago

rayiner 11y ago

The legacy of segregation in Atlanta isn't something you have to look for--you'd have to be blind not to see it: http://socialshutter.blogspot.com/2012/10/when-street-names-change-on-other-side.html http://socialshutter.blogspot.com/2012/10/when-street-names-.... > By the way, the neighborhoods are so 'cheap' because poor people lived there for a long time. (I put cheap in quotes, because homes in this neighborhood are significantly more expensive than the average home in America.) The homes require more work and the school systems have less resources. Gee, why do you think all that is?

jcizzle 11y ago
You know those streets changed names 80 years ago, right? Monroe/Boulevard split in 1932, for example. You also know that every American knows about the civil rights era, too? They teach us that in school. You can keep pointing back to history and saying 'Hey, it was unfair!' and I doubt anyone is going to disagree with you. My point is that things are changing for the better, whether you want to look forward or behind is up to you.
- rayiner 11y ago
  If I bend a paperclip, it's going to stay bent. Until someone unbends it, it's state will be attributable to my bending it, no matter how long ago that happened. I'm not saying "those neighborhoods were poor 50 years ago because they were segregated, that's so unfair!" I'm saying "those neighborhoods are still poor because they were segregated 50 years ago, and nobody has undone the effects of segregation and put those people back in the position they would have been but for segregation."
  - yummyfajitas 11y ago
    You used this exact analogy 8 months ago and it's fallaciousness was demonstrated (Asians/Jews/Irish all "unbent" themselves, as did many immigrant groups from < 50 years ago, e.g. Indians and Vietnamese boat people). Why repeat an argument you know to be flawed? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9942354 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9942354
    - tptacek 11y ago
      You are going well past your trademark contrarianism and into something creepier here.
  - dcole2929 11y ago
    yummyfajitas there is a stark difference between the experiences of the groups you mentioned in America and the 200+ years of slavery, followed by 100 years of segregation and discrimination, followed by 50+ years of racial profiling and predatory policy that blacks in America have gone through. I don't for a second doubt the hardships of other races and many have pulled themselves up from where they began here, but you can't honestly compare the two experiences and find anything more than surface level similarities.
    - yummyfajitas 11y ago
      According to Rayiner, a paperclip won't unbend itself. Now, maybe sometimes it will, other times it won't if it's been subjected to the right historical stimulus. I'm also not really sure how you can suggest the historical hardships that Korean Americans faced weren't a lot worse than black Americans. Korea was dirt poor (think worst part of Africa levels) since forever, then a war, then refugees into the racist US. Post WW2 Filipinos and post-Vietnam war Vietnamese have a very similar story. So tell me; why again is Rayiners "nothing ever unbends itself" story remotely plausible?