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You will lose weight on calorie restriction as long as you go low enough. Though I've been fat my entire life, after college, I was 150 pounds overweight. I los

by thras 17y ago

You will lose weight on calorie restriction as long as you go low enough. Though I've been fat my entire life, after college, I was 150 pounds overweight. I lost the extra weight by eating 900 calories a day for a year and a half or so. At my normal healthy weight, I was starving. And weak as a kitten. I took up running, and stopped watching my diet. I literally could not keep up the willpower necessary to continue a 3000 calorie diet, even though 900 had been doable for so long. Despite running for an hour a day, I immediately started gaining 10-15 pounds a month. So I was convinced that it was all about calories. I was fat because I ate too much. Why my body was so hellbent on eating 4000-5000 calories a day, I didn't know. I seemed to have a lot more willpower than anyone else I knew. It was sort of confusing. Then about a year ago, I read Taubes' book. What if the human body is actually sort of complicated? What if hormonal regulation controls fat? What if the "trash bin" theory of body fat is actually a humongous oversimplification or just wrong? What if, after getting to a "healthy" weight by starving fat, muscle, and vital tissue, I wasn't healthy at all? What if it had also made me malnourished (hence the amazing hunger at my "healthy" weight)? Anyway, I cut the carbohydrates out of my diet last December. I made zero effort at calorie restriction. In fact, I ate a lot. I made very little effort to exercise more. After a year of this, I'm almost 100 pounds under my max weight. I recently started running again, for fun, not weight loss, and am up to 2-3 miles a day. And I am stronger than I've ever been in my life. Eating steak every day is probably more expensive than building the same muscle mass with steroids, but I'm pretty happy. I wasn't expecting it. It's good being a carnivore.

FreeRadical 17y ago
Just out of interest, have you had any tiredness from cutting carbs from your diet? Many people on who restrict carbs, such as on the Atkins diet, experience this from what I've read.
- travisp 17y ago
  Personally, I found I actually have more energy -- which I think is from more stable blood sugar levels.
- thras 17y ago
  No tiredness for me. There's the "induction flu" that people on Atkins get, and I felt that for the first few weeks. Apparently it's caused by sodium depletion (carbohydrates cause you to retain a lot of water/salt). Drinking non-sodium-reduced beef broth every day for that month will cure you. Wish I had known. I just toughed it out. As far as my energy levels nowadays...pretty much boundless. I'm ravenously hungry when I don't eat. But I'm told that's how it's supposed to work. When I was fat, I was hungry around the clock, even after eating.
  - gojomo 17y ago
    Can you recommend any sources for more details about this 'beef broth' fix for induction discomfort? (Would other sodium replenishment options be just as good?)
- 9oliYQjP 17y ago
  There's a tiredness and "brain fade" associated with these sort of diets. I'm not so sure it's the carb cutting so much as it is the extreme calorie restriction. I used a protein sparing modified fast (which Atkins is a form of) that advocated supplementing sodium and potassium along with essential fatty acids using fish oil (it was a low fat and low carb diet). I've tried Atkins before and experienced the tiredness/brain fade. The PSMF I was on though caused me none of these symptoms. In fact, I felt precisely the opposite. During the diet, I experienced a form of mild euphoria.
- elblanco 17y ago
  I tried a regulated vegetarian diet before and a diet like the Atkins diet before and experienced the following: Veggies) Bad: -I typically felt kinda "blah", like I was on the verge of getting a cold -generally low on energy -injuries took forever to heal -my joints ached after being on the diet for about 6 months -I felt hungry almost immediately after eating -I lost much less weight than on Atkins Good: -It's hard to describe, but I felt "clean" all the time. Like I had just taken a shower. -I also tended to feel light, like moving about took less energy, but I felt like I had less energy overall Atkins) Bad: -I felt kinda "gross" all the time, like oil was oozing from my pores and follicles. -Expensive -Most of the foods I wanted to eat were not on the approved list, and I got tired of eating on the diet after about 6 months -I felt hungry all the time -Hair and nails grew really fast...like freakishly so. I was cutting my finger nails like every 2 days at one point. -I felt "heavy" Good: -I had super, non-stop, bottomless energy -no midday loss of energy -I could exercise for hours -I lost tons more weight than on the veggie diet (about 3x as much in the same amount of time) -Injuries healed super fast, maybe twice as fast as normal, and I got injured far less often than on the veggie diet, maybe 1:3 ratio -I felt stronger, so even if I felt heavier, it was less effort to move about -I packed on muscle, my bench press (without actually doing any weight lifting as a form of exercise) went from 140 to 210 in 6 months.
yummyfajitas 17y ago
You should be very careful on carb restriction. It can cause acid levels to build up in your blood which can be exceedingly dangerous. One side effect: the acids can crystalize in your bloodstream and collect at your joints. In short, you get gout/pseudogout/other gout-like conditions (depending on the exact composition of the crystals). I know someone who did this; she was bedridden for a month and couldn't turn her head for 2 months.
- thras 17y ago
  I've actually never heard of hyperuricemia being caused by carbohydrate restriction. Nobody seems to list it in the standard "drink your Coke, low-carb kills" list of warnings, either. Anyway, here's Taubes on Gout: http://www.fourhourworkweek.com/blog/2009/10/05/gout/ http://www.fourhourworkweek.com/blog/2009/10/05/gout/
- ahoyhere 17y ago
  There is a very important book you should read called _Life Without Bread_. It was that book that showed how excessive carbohydrates causes gout, and how that led my husband (who has gout at 30 b.c. of an immuneoresponsive issue) to cure his gout with low-carbohydrate diet. Now -- anybody who does "no carb" is making a big mistake. Vegetables, and legumes, etc., are a very critical part of the diet. They provide so much more than carbohydrates, such as fiber and necessary acids. And sometimes shit just freaks out. Like me, I have "steroid psychosis" type responses to very low levels of non-oral steroids. Sometimes you just have to accept that you're a freaky outlier. Plural of anecodate is not data, sadly, either way.
glymor 17y ago
What little I've read on obesity research seems to require that both excess sugar and fat are consumed to overcome homeostasis. Sugars can ignore homeostatic regulation for hedonistic reasons and fats don't have the same day to day correction that carbohydrates do. So the part that might be working in your diet might be the no-sugar part of no-carb. Overall it's quite amazing that many people can consume something like a million calories per a year and end up within 0.5kg (3500 calories) of their starting point.
jodrellblank 17y ago
Would you say more specifically what you cut from your diet, and what you retained? You don't only eat steak, do you?
- ams6110 17y ago
  Last time I lost significant (for me) weight (220 down to 180) I did it by cutting carbs. I did not eat only meat, but I did cut out all bread, other starchy food, sweet fruits, and sugars. So I ate meat, eggs, cheese, nuts, and green vegetables like broccoli, spinach, and legumes. I missed bread, because I love good home-baked bread, but you can have enough variety with other foods to keep a low-carb diet from getting boring. Atkins says to cut coffee and diet soda but I didn't do that. I did not exercise beyond normal daily activities.
  - elai 17y ago
    How about beans (like kidney beans)? Or are they too starchy?
keefe 17y ago
Going from 4K-5K calories per day to 900 is an extreme swing. These type of diets are shown not to work. There is also some evidence they convince your body it is living in feast/famine time which triggers a fat accumulation response. I do not believe that it is healthy to remove carbohydrates from your body. The body is a complex machine indeed, but we have a pretty good understanding of how it works regarding nutrition. Most structures run on glucose, muscles are made of protein, fiber helps digestion and micronutrients are used all over the place. The bottom line is that fat is used for storing extra glucose. The function of protein in nutrition is very interesting. If you don't get enough, then your body will cannibalize muscles to get it. Proteins can be broken down to provide glucose, but it's inefficient and generates toxins. Carbohydrates break down to glucose much better. I would suggest you try a conventional approach : Checkout nutritiondata.com or one of the numerous calculators and for your weight and height calculate your daily needs. Pay particular attention to the grams of fiber needed and setup a plan that leads to 1-2lbs of fat loss per week - a deficit of only 500-1000 calories per day. Changing habits faster than that is generally not practical, it certainly never was for me. Make sure you are getting enough protein without overwhelming calories, supplementing with a protein shake if necessary. Try that out for half a year or a year with daily measurements and diet recalculation every 10 lbs lost. Never, ever deviate from the selected diet (you accomplish this by leaving wiggle room in your estimates), weigh yourself daily and keep careful records. I really don't think carb free living is either sustainable or healthy.
- thras 17y ago
  It did work. I lost the weight. Pay attention to fiber? The research in support of that suggestion is execrable (pun intended). I did try the 500-1000 calorie deficit for a number of months. My weight loss was on the order of 5-10 pounds, and I was hungry the entire time. And then I gained the weight back and more when I wasn't able to carry through. People simply do not lose large amounts of weight on small deficits. It's bizarre. According to the trash bin theory of body fat it should work. It doesn't. Almost like the trash bin theory is wrong... The carb free living is sustainable and healthy. If you aren't going to read Taubes, then at least read Victor Steffansson. He's a bit more fun.
  - 17y ago
rjurney 17y ago
Without steak (protein and extra calories), steroids don't work - so yeah, you're doing the cheapest way to build muscle ;)
MikeCapone 17y ago
I'm about halfway through Taubes' book (Good Calories, Bad Calories), and I also recommend it. So far, he has made a very strong case, and the theory that he supports seems to have better predictive power than the mainstream theory.

by thras 17y ago

FreeRadical 17y ago

Just out of interest, have you had any tiredness from cutting carbs from your diet? Many people on who restrict carbs, such as on the Atkins diet, experience this from what I've read.

travisp 17y ago
Personally, I found I actually have more energy -- which I think is from more stable blood sugar levels.
thras 17y ago
No tiredness for me. There's the "induction flu" that people on Atkins get, and I felt that for the first few weeks. Apparently it's caused by sodium depletion (carbohydrates cause you to retain a lot of water/salt). Drinking non-sodium-reduced beef broth every day for that month will cure you. Wish I had known. I just toughed it out. As far as my energy levels nowadays...pretty much boundless. I'm ravenously hungry when I don't eat. But I'm told that's how it's supposed to work. When I was fat, I was hungry around the clock, even after eating.
- gojomo 17y ago
  Can you recommend any sources for more details about this 'beef broth' fix for induction discomfort? (Would other sodium replenishment options be just as good?)
9oliYQjP 17y ago
There's a tiredness and "brain fade" associated with these sort of diets. I'm not so sure it's the carb cutting so much as it is the extreme calorie restriction. I used a protein sparing modified fast (which Atkins is a form of) that advocated supplementing sodium and potassium along with essential fatty acids using fish oil (it was a low fat and low carb diet). I've tried Atkins before and experienced the tiredness/brain fade. The PSMF I was on though caused me none of these symptoms. In fact, I felt precisely the opposite. During the diet, I experienced a form of mild euphoria.
elblanco 17y ago
I tried a regulated vegetarian diet before and a diet like the Atkins diet before and experienced the following: Veggies) Bad: -I typically felt kinda "blah", like I was on the verge of getting a cold -generally low on energy -injuries took forever to heal -my joints ached after being on the diet for about 6 months -I felt hungry almost immediately after eating -I lost much less weight than on Atkins Good: -It's hard to describe, but I felt "clean" all the time. Like I had just taken a shower. -I also tended to feel light, like moving about took less energy, but I felt like I had less energy overall Atkins) Bad: -I felt kinda "gross" all the time, like oil was oozing from my pores and follicles. -Expensive -Most of the foods I wanted to eat were not on the approved list, and I got tired of eating on the diet after about 6 months -I felt hungry all the time -Hair and nails grew really fast...like freakishly so. I was cutting my finger nails like every 2 days at one point. -I felt "heavy" Good: -I had super, non-stop, bottomless energy -no midday loss of energy -I could exercise for hours -I lost tons more weight than on the veggie diet (about 3x as much in the same amount of time) -Injuries healed super fast, maybe twice as fast as normal, and I got injured far less often than on the veggie diet, maybe 1:3 ratio -I felt stronger, so even if I felt heavier, it was less effort to move about -I packed on muscle, my bench press (without actually doing any weight lifting as a form of exercise) went from 140 to 210 in 6 months.

yummyfajitas 17y ago

You should be very careful on carb restriction. It can cause acid levels to build up in your blood which can be exceedingly dangerous. One side effect: the acids can crystalize in your bloodstream and collect at your joints. In short, you get gout/pseudogout/other gout-like conditions (depending on the exact composition of the crystals). I know someone who did this; she was bedridden for a month and couldn't turn her head for 2 months.

thras 17y ago
I've actually never heard of hyperuricemia being caused by carbohydrate restriction. Nobody seems to list it in the standard "drink your Coke, low-carb kills" list of warnings, either. Anyway, here's Taubes on Gout: http://www.fourhourworkweek.com/blog/2009/10/05/gout/ http://www.fourhourworkweek.com/blog/2009/10/05/gout/
ahoyhere 17y ago
There is a very important book you should read called _Life Without Bread_. It was that book that showed how excessive carbohydrates causes gout, and how that led my husband (who has gout at 30 b.c. of an immuneoresponsive issue) to cure his gout with low-carbohydrate diet. Now -- anybody who does "no carb" is making a big mistake. Vegetables, and legumes, etc., are a very critical part of the diet. They provide so much more than carbohydrates, such as fiber and necessary acids. And sometimes shit just freaks out. Like me, I have "steroid psychosis" type responses to very low levels of non-oral steroids. Sometimes you just have to accept that you're a freaky outlier. Plural of anecodate is not data, sadly, either way.

glymor 17y ago

What little I've read on obesity research seems to require that both excess sugar and fat are consumed to overcome homeostasis. Sugars can ignore homeostatic regulation for hedonistic reasons and fats don't have the same day to day correction that carbohydrates do. So the part that might be working in your diet might be the no-sugar part of no-carb. Overall it's quite amazing that many people can consume something like a million calories per a year and end up within 0.5kg (3500 calories) of their starting point.

jodrellblank 17y ago

Would you say more specifically what you cut from your diet, and what you retained? You don't only eat steak, do you?

ams6110 17y ago
Last time I lost significant (for me) weight (220 down to 180) I did it by cutting carbs. I did not eat only meat, but I did cut out all bread, other starchy food, sweet fruits, and sugars. So I ate meat, eggs, cheese, nuts, and green vegetables like broccoli, spinach, and legumes. I missed bread, because I love good home-baked bread, but you can have enough variety with other foods to keep a low-carb diet from getting boring. Atkins says to cut coffee and diet soda but I didn't do that. I did not exercise beyond normal daily activities.
- elai 17y ago
  How about beans (like kidney beans)? Or are they too starchy?

keefe 17y ago

Going from 4K-5K calories per day to 900 is an extreme swing. These type of diets are shown not to work. There is also some evidence they convince your body it is living in feast/famine time which triggers a fat accumulation response. I do not believe that it is healthy to remove carbohydrates from your body. The body is a complex machine indeed, but we have a pretty good understanding of how it works regarding nutrition. Most structures run on glucose, muscles are made of protein, fiber helps digestion and micronutrients are used all over the place. The bottom line is that fat is used for storing extra glucose. The function of protein in nutrition is very interesting. If you don't get enough, then your body will cannibalize muscles to get it. Proteins can be broken down to provide glucose, but it's inefficient and generates toxins. Carbohydrates break down to glucose much better. I would suggest you try a conventional approach : Checkout nutritiondata.com or one of the numerous calculators and for your weight and height calculate your daily needs. Pay particular attention to the grams of fiber needed and setup a plan that leads to 1-2lbs of fat loss per week - a deficit of only 500-1000 calories per day. Changing habits faster than that is generally not practical, it certainly never was for me. Make sure you are getting enough protein without overwhelming calories, supplementing with a protein shake if necessary. Try that out for half a year or a year with daily measurements and diet recalculation every 10 lbs lost. Never, ever deviate from the selected diet (you accomplish this by leaving wiggle room in your estimates), weigh yourself daily and keep careful records. I really don't think carb free living is either sustainable or healthy.

thras 17y ago
It did work. I lost the weight. Pay attention to fiber? The research in support of that suggestion is execrable (pun intended). I did try the 500-1000 calorie deficit for a number of months. My weight loss was on the order of 5-10 pounds, and I was hungry the entire time. And then I gained the weight back and more when I wasn't able to carry through. People simply do not lose large amounts of weight on small deficits. It's bizarre. According to the trash bin theory of body fat it should work. It doesn't. Almost like the trash bin theory is wrong... The carb free living is sustainable and healthy. If you aren't going to read Taubes, then at least read Victor Steffansson. He's a bit more fun.
- 17y ago

rjurney 17y ago

Without steak (protein and extra calories), steroids don't work - so yeah, you're doing the cheapest way to build muscle ;)

MikeCapone 17y ago

I'm about halfway through Taubes' book (Good Calories, Bad Calories), and I also recommend it. So far, he has made a very strong case, and the theory that he supports seems to have better predictive power than the mainstream theory.