8 ms·

I live in Venezuela and item's prices are raising horrible, let me tell you something I am electrical engineer and computer engineer, and my salary is only 10.3

I live in Venezuela and item's prices are raising horrible, let me tell you something I am electrical engineer and computer engineer, and my salary is only 10.3$/month, ridiculous, but his is how socialism works everyone are equalized but to poverty. To buy a car in Venezuela you need to save money for 50 years without buying food supplies, to buy a house it takes 200 years, to buy dollars you need to be a friend of Maduro, my most bright colleagues have left the country so I am.

pitiburi 11y ago
I am not in Venezuela, but I work with some guys there. Your "10.3$/month" is a blatant, and pretty absurd lie. If this account created a few minutes ago is going to be used to spread lies, please use it somewhere else, not in HN. We don't need you.
- kordless 11y ago
  > We don't need you. Don't speak for me. Given at least half of us have no idea what 10.3$/month is, why don't one of you enlighten us and let us draw our own conclusions?
  - chvid 11y ago
    My guess is the poster is referring to the monthly wage of a professional in Venezuela in USD by the black market rate which probably is fairly indicative of the purchasing power. And yes. Venezuela is a touchy subject since its nasty regime sadly is idolized by many left-winged intellectuals in the west.
  - bmelton 11y ago
    So, I'll freely concede that I'm ignorant on the issue, but Bonsanto made an extraordinary claim below (that government forbids buying non-Venezuelan currency) that despite my initial idea, turns out to appear truthful. So, According to this somewhat recent article by Bloomberg[1], "A school teacher with 25 years of experience made 9,786 bolivars a month in 2014. That's about $35 a month at the current black market exchange rate, which won't even buy a used television." It's hard to tell what the actual exchange rate of the bolivar is to the dollar, because apparently Venezuela fixes the exchange rate, so while it's been steady on paper, it appears that in practice, its actual exchange rate is approximately 100 times less than the official exchange rate. The official rate indicates that 1 bolivar == .16 US dollar, but other sources indicate that the effective, actual rate in Venezuela is more like 1 boliver == .0036 US dollars (or, because my simple math skills are horrible, 100 bolivar == 36 US cents.) If that's the case, and I'm not missing something crazy, it doesn't seem far-fetched to me at all that an electrical engineer would be earning the American equivalent of $10.3 US dollars per month, depending on how you define the exchange rate. [1] - http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-03-06/monthly-salary-of-20-shows-why-venezuelans-wait-in-food-lines http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-03-06/monthly-sa...
    - aortega 11y ago
      The 10.3 u$s per month is possible. You have to remember that using the government exchange rate, food also is very cheap. Gas is almost free, IIRC about 5 or 6 bolivars to fill a tank (about 0.006 u$s I think). The thing is, you cannot buy anything imported because then the real exchange rate goes, and you actually can buy only u$s 10 worth of imported stuff. You are forced yo spend your salary in locally-produced stuff, that actually kinda work for countries like Argentina that produces a lot of stuff (except computers and high-tech products), but do not for Venezuela, that only produces oil. Interestingly, what happens if you go with your US-savings, say, u$s 50000 to Venezuela? well then you are basically a king there. You could buy half a city with that money, thats why they had to put laws to prevent foreigners to do that kind of thing. TLDR: You can be rich with u$s 10/month, as long as you dont leave the country and don't buy anything imported.
    - kordless 11y ago
      Well that's depressing. I feel for my fellow engineer in Venezuela.
      - bmelton 11y ago
        I admit that I'm pretty topic dumb -- the closest I can personalize this to is an Ameri-Cuban reality show that I watch, titled "Cuban Chrome"[1]. In it, the story apparently focuses on a couple of folks - a taxi driver, and members of a car club. Because of the trade embargoes (now lifted in theory) between Cuba and America, most of the "newer" cars in Cuba are 60s-era classics, for which finding parts is nearly impossible. Apparently Cuba's embargo has left them trading with Russia, so, if you want/need a new carburetor for your American Chevrolet, you end up having to retrofit a diesel carburetor from a Russian schoolbus, at exorbitant prices, and only by trading labor with someone capable of making the retrofit work. I know it's reality TV, which already makes it very unlike reality, but it's difficult to watch in spots, as I see people struggling with what would be, in America, a completely solved problem. [1] - http://www.discovery.com/tv-shows/cuban-chrome/ http://www.discovery.com/tv-shows/cuban-chrome/
- aortega 11y ago
  >We don't need you. Yes you need him, dude. You need every engineer you have, if you don't want to go back to medieval times.
- climber_mac 11y ago
  I am also from Venezuela. He is not lying. He calculated his salary using the black market price of a dollar: 630 bolivares. He earns close to 7000 bolivares, which is minimum wage. "Working with some guys there" is not as reliable a source as a guy who actually lives and works in the country. You shouldn't have called him a lier.
  - ced 11y ago
    Is it common for engineers to earn minimum wage?
    - bmelton 11y ago
      Apparently, it's pretty rare for skilled workers to even earn 100% of minimum wage. The median income for Venezuela is approximately 60% below minimum wage. In black market exchange rates, that equates to approximately $2 USD per month. The maximum surveyed income, according to SalaryExplorer, is 72,000 bolivars per month, which amounts to approximately 10x minimum wage, or around $100 a month. Given the median though, one assumes that is an extreme outlier.
- climber_mac 11y ago
  I am also from Venezuela. He is not lying. He calculated his salary using the black market price of a dollar: 630 bolivares. He earns close to 7000 bolivares, which is minimum wage. "Working with some guys there" is not as reliable a source as a guy who actually lives and works in the country. You shouldn't have called him a lier.
loblollyboy 11y ago
seems to work just fine in scandinavia
- xienze 11y ago
  It always works until it doesn't. Sweden will have a particularly tough time in coming years.
  - nextos 11y ago
    Why?
    - xienze 11y ago
      Sweden in particular? Like the rest of Europe, absolutely dismal birth rates and an aging population. Sweden is also particularly gung-ho about granting citizenship to any and everyone who shows up. That places additional strain on the system as the people showing up are a net drain on finances.
    - cb18 11y ago
      Sweden will have a particularly tough time in coming years. Why? Sweden is already in pretty bad shape due to immigration. But a large part of the govt, and dominant information channels are intent on concealing that fact as much as possible for some reason, hard for some people to admit they were wrong I guess. Shockingly enough, Sweden leads the world in rape and school arson. Informative report on the horrible rape numbers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCGedOGCrnQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCGedOGCrnQ Last year the cost for fires in Sweden’s schools ended at about SEK one billion. 457 schools burned in 2009. About half of the fires were caused by arson. However, compared with 2008 fires in schools has decreased, that year 512 schools burned, also then half of them caused by arson. http://www.stockholmnews.com/more.aspx?NID=5029 http://www.stockholmnews.com/more.aspx?NID=5029 (Saying in both years that only half of that already large number were caused by arson seems a little suspect, that seems like a high rate for schools to be combusting from other factors. Well, maybe they are counting chemistry lab mishaps and the like, and the bulk of the cost is coming from schools actually being burned down in arson attacks.) “I don’t know why anybody would want to burn our school,” Ms. Bromster said. “I can’t understand it. Maybe they are not so happy with life.” The riots are not unprecedented here. In 2008 and 2010, immigrants clashed with the police in the southern port city of Malmo. But the past week’s arson attacks in Stockholm, the capital, and the spectacle of teenagers hurling stones at firefighters have left many Swedes wondering what went wrong in a society that has invested so heavily in helping the underprivileged. http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/27/world/europe/swedens-riots-put-its-identity-in-question.html?_r=0 http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/27/world/europe/swedens-riots...

pitiburi 11y ago

I am not in Venezuela, but I work with some guys there. Your "10.3$/month" is a blatant, and pretty absurd lie. If this account created a few minutes ago is going to be used to spread lies, please use it somewhere else, not in HN. We don't need you.

kordless 11y ago
> We don't need you. Don't speak for me. Given at least half of us have no idea what 10.3$/month is, why don't one of you enlighten us and let us draw our own conclusions?
- chvid 11y ago
  My guess is the poster is referring to the monthly wage of a professional in Venezuela in USD by the black market rate which probably is fairly indicative of the purchasing power. And yes. Venezuela is a touchy subject since its nasty regime sadly is idolized by many left-winged intellectuals in the west.
- bmelton 11y ago
  So, I'll freely concede that I'm ignorant on the issue, but Bonsanto made an extraordinary claim below (that government forbids buying non-Venezuelan currency) that despite my initial idea, turns out to appear truthful. So, According to this somewhat recent article by Bloomberg[1], "A school teacher with 25 years of experience made 9,786 bolivars a month in 2014. That's about $35 a month at the current black market exchange rate, which won't even buy a used television." It's hard to tell what the actual exchange rate of the bolivar is to the dollar, because apparently Venezuela fixes the exchange rate, so while it's been steady on paper, it appears that in practice, its actual exchange rate is approximately 100 times less than the official exchange rate. The official rate indicates that 1 bolivar == .16 US dollar, but other sources indicate that the effective, actual rate in Venezuela is more like 1 boliver == .0036 US dollars (or, because my simple math skills are horrible, 100 bolivar == 36 US cents.) If that's the case, and I'm not missing something crazy, it doesn't seem far-fetched to me at all that an electrical engineer would be earning the American equivalent of $10.3 US dollars per month, depending on how you define the exchange rate. [1] - http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-03-06/monthly-salary-of-20-shows-why-venezuelans-wait-in-food-lines http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-03-06/monthly-sa...
  - aortega 11y ago
    The 10.3 u$s per month is possible. You have to remember that using the government exchange rate, food also is very cheap. Gas is almost free, IIRC about 5 or 6 bolivars to fill a tank (about 0.006 u$s I think). The thing is, you cannot buy anything imported because then the real exchange rate goes, and you actually can buy only u$s 10 worth of imported stuff. You are forced yo spend your salary in locally-produced stuff, that actually kinda work for countries like Argentina that produces a lot of stuff (except computers and high-tech products), but do not for Venezuela, that only produces oil. Interestingly, what happens if you go with your US-savings, say, u$s 50000 to Venezuela? well then you are basically a king there. You could buy half a city with that money, thats why they had to put laws to prevent foreigners to do that kind of thing. TLDR: You can be rich with u$s 10/month, as long as you dont leave the country and don't buy anything imported.
  - kordless 11y ago
    Well that's depressing. I feel for my fellow engineer in Venezuela.
    - bmelton 11y ago
      I admit that I'm pretty topic dumb -- the closest I can personalize this to is an Ameri-Cuban reality show that I watch, titled "Cuban Chrome"[1]. In it, the story apparently focuses on a couple of folks - a taxi driver, and members of a car club. Because of the trade embargoes (now lifted in theory) between Cuba and America, most of the "newer" cars in Cuba are 60s-era classics, for which finding parts is nearly impossible. Apparently Cuba's embargo has left them trading with Russia, so, if you want/need a new carburetor for your American Chevrolet, you end up having to retrofit a diesel carburetor from a Russian schoolbus, at exorbitant prices, and only by trading labor with someone capable of making the retrofit work. I know it's reality TV, which already makes it very unlike reality, but it's difficult to watch in spots, as I see people struggling with what would be, in America, a completely solved problem. [1] - http://www.discovery.com/tv-shows/cuban-chrome/ http://www.discovery.com/tv-shows/cuban-chrome/
aortega 11y ago
>We don't need you. Yes you need him, dude. You need every engineer you have, if you don't want to go back to medieval times.
climber_mac 11y ago
I am also from Venezuela. He is not lying. He calculated his salary using the black market price of a dollar: 630 bolivares. He earns close to 7000 bolivares, which is minimum wage. "Working with some guys there" is not as reliable a source as a guy who actually lives and works in the country. You shouldn't have called him a lier.
- ced 11y ago
  Is it common for engineers to earn minimum wage?
  - bmelton 11y ago
    Apparently, it's pretty rare for skilled workers to even earn 100% of minimum wage. The median income for Venezuela is approximately 60% below minimum wage. In black market exchange rates, that equates to approximately $2 USD per month. The maximum surveyed income, according to SalaryExplorer, is 72,000 bolivars per month, which amounts to approximately 10x minimum wage, or around $100 a month. Given the median though, one assumes that is an extreme outlier.
climber_mac 11y ago
I am also from Venezuela. He is not lying. He calculated his salary using the black market price of a dollar: 630 bolivares. He earns close to 7000 bolivares, which is minimum wage. "Working with some guys there" is not as reliable a source as a guy who actually lives and works in the country. You shouldn't have called him a lier.

loblollyboy 11y ago

seems to work just fine in scandinavia

xienze 11y ago
It always works until it doesn't. Sweden will have a particularly tough time in coming years.
- nextos 11y ago
  Why?
  - xienze 11y ago
    Sweden in particular? Like the rest of Europe, absolutely dismal birth rates and an aging population. Sweden is also particularly gung-ho about granting citizenship to any and everyone who shows up. That places additional strain on the system as the people showing up are a net drain on finances.
  - cb18 11y ago
    Sweden will have a particularly tough time in coming years. Why? Sweden is already in pretty bad shape due to immigration. But a large part of the govt, and dominant information channels are intent on concealing that fact as much as possible for some reason, hard for some people to admit they were wrong I guess. Shockingly enough, Sweden leads the world in rape and school arson. Informative report on the horrible rape numbers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCGedOGCrnQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCGedOGCrnQ Last year the cost for fires in Sweden’s schools ended at about SEK one billion. 457 schools burned in 2009. About half of the fires were caused by arson. However, compared with 2008 fires in schools has decreased, that year 512 schools burned, also then half of them caused by arson. http://www.stockholmnews.com/more.aspx?NID=5029 http://www.stockholmnews.com/more.aspx?NID=5029 (Saying in both years that only half of that already large number were caused by arson seems a little suspect, that seems like a high rate for schools to be combusting from other factors. Well, maybe they are counting chemistry lab mishaps and the like, and the bulk of the cost is coming from schools actually being burned down in arson attacks.) “I don’t know why anybody would want to burn our school,” Ms. Bromster said. “I can’t understand it. Maybe they are not so happy with life.” The riots are not unprecedented here. In 2008 and 2010, immigrants clashed with the police in the southern port city of Malmo. But the past week’s arson attacks in Stockholm, the capital, and the spectacle of teenagers hurling stones at firefighters have left many Swedes wondering what went wrong in a society that has invested so heavily in helping the underprivileged. http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/27/world/europe/swedens-riots-put-its-identity-in-question.html?_r=0 http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/27/world/europe/swedens-riots...