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I group "Code of Conduct" with Political Correctness. For anyone interested in a good read on the subject, check out End of Discussion: How the Left's Outrage

by anon3_ 11y ago

I group "Code of Conduct" with Political Correctness. For anyone interested in a good read on the subject, check out End of Discussion: How the Left's Outrage Industry Shuts Down Debate, Manipulates Voters, and Makes America Less Free (and Fun) by Mary Ham and Guy Benson. It's an excellent read, and shouldn't be too much of a sting to the social outrage panderers out there.

sagichmal 11y ago
> I set up my web browser to automatically change > "political correctness" to "treating people with > respect" https://twitter.com/byronclarknz/status/628702214391902208 https://twitter.com/byronclarknz/status/628702214391902208 If you use the phrase "social outrage" or "social justice" as a pejorative, you're part of the problem :)
- tfb 11y ago
  The phrases "political correctness" and "treating people with respect" describe entirely different things. They are not interchangeable without altering the meaning of the sentence, as they refer to two completely different concepts. Whether or not you agree with the intended meaning is irrelevant. The meaning is still there. Just to be clear, I'm all for treating people with respect, as any decent human being should be. And political correctness is perfectly fine and necessary in most cases, but in most contexts it refers to conforming to certain narratives to avoid scrutiny and being ostracized, which typically only exists to serve some underlying agenda. It's been taken to the extremes lately and conflating "political correctness" with "treating people with respect" is a mistake, because more often than not, political correctness does more harm than good. Imagine there's a serious security flaw in some software but no one will speak up about it because it might result in ostracizing whoever does speak up about it because it offends people. The more freely people are allowed to express themselves, the better off we will all be, regardless of the message. But yes, when speaking freely, one should also be respectful. You can be politically incorrect and treat people with respect at the same time. That is why those phrases are not interchangeable.
- rorykoehler 11y ago
  I was thinking of doing something similar as a chrome plugin to counter propaganda on mass media sites but I never got around to it. You've inspired me to bump that up the weekend project to-do list again
- d9h549f34w6 11y ago
  What Person A sees as a good sort of social justice may not like up with Person B's interpretation. It is possible for movements to sully the name of a stated positive goal. Beware of reading books by their covers. That's the sort of thinking that got the US stuck with the Patriot Act or other sorts of legislation. Especially after a terrorist attack, people don't want to be opponents of "patriotism" (which gets defined by one side to mean a very specific thing).
- tomp 11y ago
  Huh? "Outrage" is practically uniformly worse than other, "non-outrageous" ways of solving problems. Whenever the word "justice" is modified by another word, that's usually a very good sign that the expression doesn't mean justice.
- zxcvcxz 11y ago
  What do you call people who use social justice as an excuse to harass and belittle people who have different opinions than them? You shouldn't be upset at people using terms like social justice as a pejorative, you should be upset that people are attempting to push authoritarian ideology under the moniker of social justice :)
  - sagichmal 11y ago
    > What do you call people who use social justice as an > excuse to harass and belittle people who have different > opinions than them? Strawmen :)
- anon3_ 11y ago
  > If you use the phrase "social outrage" or "social justice" as a pejorative, you're part of the problem :) The first thing is to understand it's a problem to simply prima facie discount someone. It is outrage at social things. 9/10 of the people complaining are just trolls who don't even code. The rest are beta males who emasculate themselves playing apart in it. 5 years from now - they're going to risk losing too much face to dig themselves out of the chasm of imaginary virtue they dug themselves into. Also, for those who may be open to hearing a different perspective from their own (hint hint: we conservatives are not boogie men seeking to bully women and gays) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRUgFG5XQiM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRUgFG5XQiM
  - vfdfv 11y ago
    Ah I just knew I would see mention of "beta male" strewn somewhere in this shithole thread. You are a moron :)
    - dang 11y ago
      > Ah I just knew I would see mention of "beta male" strewn somewhere in this shithole thread. You are a moron :) Hi there, please take a moment to get (or re-get) up to speed with HN's standards for commenting: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html It's critical that comments here be civil and substantive, even when someone else's comments aren't, indeed even when they seem like a moron. Otherwise discussions get sucked into the tedious downward spiral that this site exists to try to avoid. Normally we'd ban a new account that posts comments like that, since we get a lot of them, mostly by serial trolls. But you've already posted a couple of interesting comments, so I'd like to give you the benefit of the doubt.
      - vfdfv 11y ago
        Sorry for wasting your time dang. I am actually not new here, so I don't have the excuse of not knowing the guidelines, but I am normally much better behaved. It won't happen again!

by anon3_ 11y ago

sagichmal 11y ago

> I set up my web browser to automatically change > "political correctness" to "treating people with > respect" https://twitter.com/byronclarknz/status/628702214391902208 https://twitter.com/byronclarknz/status/628702214391902208 If you use the phrase "social outrage" or "social justice" as a pejorative, you're part of the problem :)

tfb 11y ago
The phrases "political correctness" and "treating people with respect" describe entirely different things. They are not interchangeable without altering the meaning of the sentence, as they refer to two completely different concepts. Whether or not you agree with the intended meaning is irrelevant. The meaning is still there. Just to be clear, I'm all for treating people with respect, as any decent human being should be. And political correctness is perfectly fine and necessary in most cases, but in most contexts it refers to conforming to certain narratives to avoid scrutiny and being ostracized, which typically only exists to serve some underlying agenda. It's been taken to the extremes lately and conflating "political correctness" with "treating people with respect" is a mistake, because more often than not, political correctness does more harm than good. Imagine there's a serious security flaw in some software but no one will speak up about it because it might result in ostracizing whoever does speak up about it because it offends people. The more freely people are allowed to express themselves, the better off we will all be, regardless of the message. But yes, when speaking freely, one should also be respectful. You can be politically incorrect and treat people with respect at the same time. That is why those phrases are not interchangeable.
rorykoehler 11y ago
I was thinking of doing something similar as a chrome plugin to counter propaganda on mass media sites but I never got around to it. You've inspired me to bump that up the weekend project to-do list again
d9h549f34w6 11y ago
What Person A sees as a good sort of social justice may not like up with Person B's interpretation. It is possible for movements to sully the name of a stated positive goal. Beware of reading books by their covers. That's the sort of thinking that got the US stuck with the Patriot Act or other sorts of legislation. Especially after a terrorist attack, people don't want to be opponents of "patriotism" (which gets defined by one side to mean a very specific thing).
tomp 11y ago
Huh? "Outrage" is practically uniformly worse than other, "non-outrageous" ways of solving problems. Whenever the word "justice" is modified by another word, that's usually a very good sign that the expression doesn't mean justice.
zxcvcxz 11y ago
What do you call people who use social justice as an excuse to harass and belittle people who have different opinions than them? You shouldn't be upset at people using terms like social justice as a pejorative, you should be upset that people are attempting to push authoritarian ideology under the moniker of social justice :)
- sagichmal 11y ago
  > What do you call people who use social justice as an > excuse to harass and belittle people who have different > opinions than them? Strawmen :)
anon3_ 11y ago
> If you use the phrase "social outrage" or "social justice" as a pejorative, you're part of the problem :) The first thing is to understand it's a problem to simply prima facie discount someone. It is outrage at social things. 9/10 of the people complaining are just trolls who don't even code. The rest are beta males who emasculate themselves playing apart in it. 5 years from now - they're going to risk losing too much face to dig themselves out of the chasm of imaginary virtue they dug themselves into. Also, for those who may be open to hearing a different perspective from their own (hint hint: we conservatives are not boogie men seeking to bully women and gays) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRUgFG5XQiM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRUgFG5XQiM
- vfdfv 11y ago
  Ah I just knew I would see mention of "beta male" strewn somewhere in this shithole thread. You are a moron :)
  - dang 11y ago
    > Ah I just knew I would see mention of "beta male" strewn somewhere in this shithole thread. You are a moron :) Hi there, please take a moment to get (or re-get) up to speed with HN's standards for commenting: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html It's critical that comments here be civil and substantive, even when someone else's comments aren't, indeed even when they seem like a moron. Otherwise discussions get sucked into the tedious downward spiral that this site exists to try to avoid. Normally we'd ban a new account that posts comments like that, since we get a lot of them, mostly by serial trolls. But you've already posted a couple of interesting comments, so I'd like to give you the benefit of the doubt.
    - vfdfv 11y ago
      Sorry for wasting your time dang. I am actually not new here, so I don't have the excuse of not knowing the guidelines, but I am normally much better behaved. It won't happen again!